Guest TPAFKATS Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 Surprised someone as erudite as Orcsoft didnae pick you up on this. the one thing that it literally isn’t is - maths. you’re thinking of - literally - arithmetic. this may help...https://www.mathmedia.com/whatisdifbet.html Thank you Tom Hendrie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 14 hours ago, BuddieinEK said: So the board should keep that promise yet it was ok to break the one to consult fans before deciding on allocation? Hypocrite! Not at all, in an ideal world I would want them to keep every promise but I'm also a realist (not an idealist like you). I know they'll make mistakes along the way. You clearly think that mistakes aren't allowed at all. If me having a bit more tolerance over a brand new board makes me a hypocrite, fine. But I think it's extremely harsh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 14 hours ago, BuddieinEK said: "significant income" It was two players very recently! You genuinely don't think potentially two players wages is significant? What planet are you on??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 14 hours ago, BuddieinEK said: Feel free to show where I have 'reversed' or backtracked anywhere in my posts. You'll find I have been completely consistent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Pityme Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 1 minute ago, bazil85 said: Feel free to show where I have 'reversed' or backtracked anywhere in my posts. You'll find I have been completely consistent. Gotta agree with Baz his posts have all been shite! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 14 hours ago, TPAFKATS said: The only one kidding themselves is you because you have linked an increase in average gates so far this season with giving the OF an extra stand. Now you are backtracking to significant income which is what Isle of Bute Saint was saying about a week ago. So basically we're back where we were days ago with folk now going to ask for a definition of significant income. And here we go for another fortnight. It's like an international break... Completely incorrect, as I said above, feel free to show where I have backtracked? Do you genuinely think there is zero link between getting over 4,000 (likely) fans in the stadium this season isn't linked to increased income at all? Really?? To clarify (crazy I even need to) I consider income that can get us a couple players considerable Why doesn't everyone put their own ball park on what income this has generated? I have given you all the maths (backed with evidence) so feel free to have your own guesses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 13 hours ago, oaksoft said: You are now resorting to deliberately manipulating my carefully chosen words and introduced apparent arguments which I have not made. Not a single person on here has said this has not created money. Not one person. Neither has anyone said we should go back to the old model. If you want to believe that engaging in this sort of pish wins you an argument then fill your boots because I have better things to do with my time. Manipulating? It was a very simple question, 'Do you think the W6/W7 model is still a viable alternative?' What's manipulating about that? I don't think it is so I have therefore compared one stand to two. Not sure why you have such an issue with me transparently doing that and offering to do the alternative if you see it as viable? What income do you think it's generated in comparison to one stand? (which again I have been open about regarding my comparison GLS even gave the W7 boys as an example to why they were looking at two stands at the time) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 (edited) 11 hours ago, antrin said: Surprised someone as erudite as Orcsoft didnae pick you up on this. the one thing that it literally isn’t is - maths. you’re thinking of - literally - arithmetic. this may help... https://www.mathmedia.com/whatisdifbet.html In fact didn't read this right, I'll give you that one. Unlike others on here I am completely happy to put my hands up at my errors. But yes arithmetic does confirm my points, that is correct. Edited April 8, 2019 by bazil85 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 8 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said: Gotta agree with Baz his posts have all been shite! From the hands down king of the mistake on here... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 Completely incorrect, as I said above, feel free to show where I have backtracked? Do you genuinely think there is zero link between getting over 4,000 (likely) fans in the stadium this season isn't linked to increased income at all? Really?? To clarify (crazy I even need to) I consider income that can get us a couple players considerable [emoji38] Why doesn't everyone put their own ball park on what income this has generated? I have given you all the maths (backed with evidence) so feel free to have your own guesses. That's the point. No one says there aren't more fans at the game, just that they aren't necessarily linked to giving the OF an extra stand.BTW, you've just backtracked again by not linking them in your post [emoji3] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 1 minute ago, TPAFKATS said: That's the point. No one says there aren't more fans at the game, just that they aren't necessarily linked to giving the OF an extra stand. BTW, you've just backtracked again by not linking them in your post My point is/ was that this set-up generates considerable income (IMO between 1 and 2 players wages or up to a six figure sum if we had managed to get top six this season. Not to think that is considerable is madness) for the football club. It has been since my very first post on the subject shortly after it was announced. I haven't deviated or 'backtracked' from that point once. I have also never said: - This is the one and only single factor linked to increased income from higher crowds - There are no other mitigating factors to be considered - I am making this financial income judgement based on the last time we were in the SP and gave them W6 & W7. I have been completely consistent with my messages on this, like I say, feel free to point out any backtracking. You won't find me making any of those three claims I'm afraid. Still looking to see some other peoples opinion on what the income is likely to be given we have close to sold out that extra stand three times, the ticket prices are up to £27, I have provided evidence police costs aren't overlay excessive, we don't appear to have lost much (if any) fan numbers elsewhere over the season and that wages are tax deductible... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Pityme Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 The home support was down by 1000 last Wednesday. Its a finacially ruinous decision taken by an out of touch board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antrin Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 1 hour ago, bazil85 said: In fact didn't read this right, I'll give you that one. Unlike others on here I am completely happy to put my hands up at my errors. But yes arithmetic does confirm my points, that is correct. I like your front! In no way did my pointing out your misuse of the Maths term confirm your claims. Conversely, people might think if you can't get the words right, what chance is there of the Arithmetic being accurate? Thin ice, bazil... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddieinEK Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 My point is/ was that this set-up generates considerable income (IMO between 1 and 2 players wages or up to a six figure sum if we had managed to get top six this season. Not to think that is considerable is madness) for the football club. It has been since my very first post on the subject shortly after it was announced. I haven't deviated or 'backtracked' from that point once. I have also never said: - This is the one and only single factor linked to increased income from higher crowds - There are no other mitigating factors to be considered - I am making this financial income judgement based on the last time we were in the SP and gave them W6 & W7. I have been completely consistent with my messages on this, like I say, feel free to point out any backtracking. You won't find me making any of those three claims I'm afraid. Still looking to see some other peoples opinion on what the income is likely to be given we have close to sold out that extra stand three times, the ticket prices are up to £27, I have provided evidence police costs aren't overlay excessive, we don't appear to have lost much (if any) fan numbers elsewhere over the season and that wages are tax deductible... Yet again, I ask you...Season tickets for the family stand were sold at a reduced rate this season.Due solely to that reduction, how much was our income down by?Going by your previous statements, it was magically zero! [emoji23] [emoji23] [emoji23] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 My point is/ was that this set-up generates considerable income (IMO between 1 and 2 players wages or up to a six figure sum if we had managed to get top six this season. Not to think that is considerable is madness) for the football club. It has been since my very first post on the subject shortly after it was announced. I haven't deviated or 'backtracked' from that point once. I have also never said: - This is the one and only single factor linked to increased income from higher crowds - There are no other mitigating factors to be considered - I am making this financial income judgement based on the last time we were in the SP and gave them W6 & W7. I have been completely consistent with my messages on this, like I say, feel free to point out any backtracking. You won't find me making any of those three claims I'm afraid. Still looking to see some other peoples opinion on what the income is likely to be given we have close to sold out that extra stand three times, the ticket prices are up to £27, I have provided evidence police costs aren't overlay excessive, we don't appear to have lost much (if any) fan numbers elsewhere over the season and that wages are tax deductible... I'll repeat it one last time bazil-You haven't managed to prove that this set up generates considerable income. You have managed to point out that our crowds are up this season which will generate additional income. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 18 minutes ago, antrin said: I like your front! In no way did my pointing out your misuse of the Maths term confirm your claims. Conversely, people might think if you can't get the words right, what chance is there of the Arithmetic being accurate? Thin ice, bazil... What’s your estimate for the income the arrangement has returned? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 10 minutes ago, BuddieinEK said: Yet again, I ask you... Season tickets for the family stand were sold at a reduced rate this season. Due solely to that reduction, how much was our income down by? Going by your previous statements, it was magically zero! Yet again I will answer as I did the first time you asked. WITHOUT KNOWING THE NUMBERS I COULDNT KNOW FOR SURE i’ll ask you again, what do you think the estimated income is from this arrangement? Given we have likely no more than a few 100 season ticket holders in the family stand, this only impacts three games and they’re being replaced was roughly 1,500 fans paying up to £27, do you genuinely believe some of them not paying £10 to move will have a massive impact on the bottom line income? Ironically I answered you, you haven’t answered this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 9 minutes ago, TPAFKATS said: I'll repeat it one last time bazil- You haven't managed to prove that this set up generates considerable income. You have managed to point out that our crowds are up this season which will generate additional income. I’ll ask you again, do you genuinely not think an arrangement that has seen over 4,500 extra bums on seats paying up to £27 a pop has not generated additional income? What more proof can I provide other than the crowd numbers, the police costs and the ticket prices? If it isn’t generating income, where are we losing it? Because it sure isn’t from people not turning up which I have evidenced through crowd numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddieinEK Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 Yet again I will answer as I did the first time you asked. WITHOUT KNOWING THE NUMBERS I COULDNT KNOW FOR SURE i’ll ask you again, what do you think the estimated income is from this arrangement? Given we have likely no more than a few 100 season ticket holders in the family stand, this only impacts three games and they’re being replaced was roughly 1,500 fans paying up to £27, do you genuinely believe some of them not paying £10 to move will have a massive impact on the bottom line income? Ironically I answered you, you haven’t answered this. I'm not making spurious claims about the size of the income.I have consistently pointed out that you have completely ignored a number of factors which will reduce the additional income.You now admit you have no idea the amount of reduced income, therefore admit you cannot possibly know the increased profit.We're getting somewhere at last! [emoji23] [emoji23] [emoji23] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddieinEK Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 Yet again I will answer as I did the first time you asked. WITHOUT KNOWING THE NUMBERS I COULDNT KNOW FOR SURE i’ll ask you again, what do you think the estimated income is from this arrangement? Given we have likely no more than a few 100 season ticket holders in the family stand, this only impacts three games and they’re being replaced was roughly 1,500 fans paying up to £27, do you genuinely believe some of them not paying £10 to move will have a massive impact on the bottom line income? Ironically I answered you, you haven’t answered this. a few 100?[emoji23] [emoji23] [emoji23] [emoji23] [emoji23] [emoji23] You just don't know yet still try to claim you are presenting "facts"! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddieinEK Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 I’ll ask you again, do you genuinely not think an arrangement that has seen over 4,500 extra bums on seats paying up to £27 a pop has not generated additional income? What more proof can I provide other than the crowd numbers, the police costs and the ticket prices? If it isn’t generating income, where are we losing it? Because it sure isn’t from people not turning up which I have evidenced through crowd numbers. So it is now 4500 extra bums on seats... All conveniently paying the adult ticket price?They previously had W6 and 7 but you also conveniently forget to deduct that number from your total "additional" places.You don't deduct reduced season ticket income.You fail to factor in increased stewarding costs.You are all over the place with this one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 12 minutes ago, BuddieinEK said: I'm not making spurious claims about the size of the income. I have consistently pointed out that you have completely ignored a number of factors which will reduce the additional income. You now admit you have no idea the amount of reduced income, therefore admit you cannot possibly know the increased profit. We're getting somewhere at last! Well I guess it's time for some more mat... I mean arithmetic isn't it? Let's start with the basics which I'm sure even you would struggle to argue with. And again I'm going to do it very (very, very) conservative. 4,500 extra fans over the three games paying £20 each (allowing for some on £27 and some kids) £90,000 - police cost of no more (likely much less) of £3,000 per game. Again feel free to google police costs in this country. £81,000 At last count there were over 3,200 season tickets sold. Let's say roughly 1,000 are in the family stand (it will be much less) 1,000 fans and lets say none of them take up the £10 option for three games against the bigot brothers. A loss of £30,000. So £81,000 in income under the conditions where zero fans take up the offer at highly inflated numbers (and not including concessions) would still be an income of... drum role £51,000! Our average first team player makes £46,169. What factors am I missing with the income here? like this is genuinely basic stuff. Surely you must accept the reduction I have estimated here is massively exaggerated and I'm still right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 14 minutes ago, BuddieinEK said: So it is now 4500 extra bums on seats... All conveniently paying the adult ticket price? They previously had W6 and 7 but you also conveniently forget to deduct that number from your total "additional" places. You don't deduct reduced season ticket income. You fail to factor in increased stewarding costs. You are all over the place with this one! Nope, I worked it out on the very reserved £20 to allow for concessions, I also ignored that the stand actually holds more than 1,500 and the strengthened position we'd be in for catering. Again it was very reserved. Police costs are £4,500 per game and they're weighted to bigger crowds so ours will be low end of the scale. Believe it or not a few extra stewards won't be a considerable expense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Pityme Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 Baz be like..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddieinEK Posted April 8, 2019 Report Share Posted April 8, 2019 Well I guess it's time for some more mat... I mean arithmetic isn't it? Let's start with the basics which I'm sure even you would struggle to argue with. And again I'm going to do it very (very, very) conservative. 4,500 extra fans over the three games paying £20 each (allowing for some on £27 and some kids) £90,000 - police cost of no more (likely much less) of £3,000 per game. Again feel free to google police costs in this country. £81,000 At last count there were over 3,200 season tickets sold. Let's say roughly 1,000 are in the family stand (it will be much less) 1,000 fans and lets say none of them take up the £10 option for three games against the bigot brothers. A loss of £30,000. So £81,000 in income under the conditions where zero fans take up the offer at highly inflated numbers (and not including concessions) would still be an income of... drum role £51,000! Our average first team player makes £46,169. What factors am I missing with the income here? [emoji38] like this is genuinely basic stuff. Surely you must accept the reduction I have estimated here is massively exaggerated and I'm still right. Lost fans.Kids lost to the game for years to come?So you have now more than halfed your estimated profit that you were adamant was correct.More reversing bleepers! Back to the 4,500 EXTRA supporters... How was that calculated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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