Ferguson Shipyard & Scottish Government

[pozbaird]

Scottish Government say they can't rule out buying the yard. Why is this. It should be ruled out immediately. It's a private sector business which has the Sevco shysters already sniffing around. The chunts already bought Prestwick airport for a quid.... Wee Eck that is, not the Easdales. The Easdales missed out in buying Rangers for a quid mind you.

Are taxpayers going to buy every business that hits hard times, or just the ones that El Presidente Salmonde deems politically 'sensitive'.

[Isle Of Bute Saint]

But what currency is he going to use to buy it, don't say it's the pound !

Have heard we will have a new fleet of aircraft carriers built for the Scottish navy and if word is true a feet of new roll on roll off car ferries. A luxury cruse liner for Scottish government officials to sail the world to show off our ship building skills so that we can build ships for other countries. Due to all the work load this ship yard will take on 20,000 new apprentice-ships

That being the case then this yard could make the Scottish tax payer some extra money while giving youngsters the chance of a career.

[TediousTom]

^{The first point that must be made is that being in the union really has destroyed our ship building. It may have folded anyway but the lying, desperate shysters of better together have tried very hard to convince us that ship building could only be saved by the union. Clear, desperate and shameful lies.}

^{Could a yard operate competitively in an independent Scotland?}

^{Why not, in fact why can our great little country not sustain a yard? Ships still roam the seas, trawlers still trawl and all boats need building and fixing just as they always did. Ship building need not leave the Clyde and it is far too an important industry to allow it to die without effort. The greed of the union in demanding the idiotic corporation tax has only served to strangle our industry. As such I see this as an investment in Scotland worth making.}

[pozbaird]

Ach, having given it more thought, I blame Cheesy.

[rabuddies]

The only serious shipbuilding left in Scotland is that which builds for the RN and other countries and I would think that that is what the Yes campaign is referring to. Ferguson's is iconic but only because it's the last yard on the lower Clyde but it has been struggling for orders and investors for several years now. Ferguson's is a pretty small employer but it is still a tragedy to the poor sods that have lost their living.

Sadly, the type of work that they do, primarily RORO's, can be done better and more cheaply elsewhere. Any attempt by wee Eck and his chums is merely political posturing as there is only one Scottish customer of note and that's Calmac. Christ, even the French can build them cheaper these days although they have a big tie-up with the Koreans, who certainly can build much cheaper components.

Edited for typos.

Edited August 19, 2014 by rabuddies

[pozbaird]

Ferguson: Shuts with the loss of nearly eighty jobs.

Ferguson: Police shooting unarmed black teenagers dead.

Ferguson: Fcuked 8-1 by Sevco Franchise.

Sir Alex must be shitting it.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

I'm sure the multi millionaire 'socialist' will be fine.

[Isle Of Bute Saint]

The only serious shipbuilding left in Scotland is that which builds for the RN and other countries and I would think that that is what the Yes campaign is referring to. Ferguson's is iconic but only because it's the last yard on the lower Clyde but it has been struggling for orders and investors for several years now. Ferguson's is a pretty small employer but it is still a tragedy to the poor sods that have lost their living.

Sadly, the type of work that they do, primarily RORO's, can be done better and more cheaply elsewhere. Any attempt by wee Eck and his chums is merely political posturing as there is only one Scottish customer of note and that's Calmac. Christ, even the French can build them cheaper these days although they have a big tie-up with the Koreans, who certainly can build much cheaper components.

Edited for typos.

The only serious shipbuilding left in Scotland is that which builds for the RN and other countries and I would think that that is what the Yes campaign is referring to. Ferguson's is iconic but only because it's the last yard on the lower Clyde but it has been struggling for orders and investors for several years now. Ferguson's is a pretty small employer but it is still a tragedy to the poor sods that have lost their living.

Sadly, the type of work that they do, primarily RORO's, can be done better and more cheaply elsewhere. Any attempt by wee Eck and his chums is merely political posturing as there is only one Scottish customer of note and that's Calmac. Christ, even the French can build them cheaper these days although they have a big tie-up with the Koreans, who certainly can build much cheaper components.

Edited for typos.

Cal Mac latest ferries are to the Isle Of Bute 2 of them and they were built in Poland.

The pride of the British fleet Elizabeth was built in Germany and then sailed to France to be fitted out. An utter joke.

[WeeBud]

Cal Mac latest ferries are to the Isle Of Bute 2 of them and they were built in Poland.

The pride of the British fleet Elizabeth was built in Germany and then sailed to France to be fitted out. An utter joke.

Not quite IoBS but not far-off!!

Loch Seaforth just been built in Germany (and Poland) but two smaller hybrid ferries for CalMac built at Fergusons last year.

Not sure what the answer is but it is a shame to see another yard close down.

[Stuart Dickson]

Scottish Government say they can't rule out buying the yard. Why is this. It should be ruled out immediately. It's a private sector business which has the Sevco shysters already sniffing around. The chunts already bought Prestwick airport for a quid.... Wee Eck that is, not the Easdales. The Easdales missed out in buying Rangers for a quid mind you.

Are taxpayers going to buy every business that hits hard times, or just the ones that El Presidente Salmonde deems politically 'sensitive'.

I don't understand the Scottish Governments reaction to be honest with you Poz, unless ofcourse it's about playing fast and loose with people's careers to make a political point before the referendum. Three years ago John Swinney as Finance Minister for the Scottish Government awarded Fergusons a £20m contract to build two hybrid ferries for Scottish Government owned Cal Mac. The money was supposed create 100 new jobs as well as securing the future for their then workforce of 75. The contact award was announced on the 3rd of November 2011. That first ship was completed on the 17th of December 2012 and the second on the 23rd of May 2013 since then the only work the yard have managed to secure is some sub contracted work for Babcocks working on the order they've got for the UK Government's aircraft carriers and some refit work stripping out a ship and converting it to a fish farm.

If the Scottish Government was so keen to keep the yard open why did it not place another order for these ferries? The Cal Mac fleet is ageing and many crossings have had to be cancelled in recent years because of breakdowns.

Earlier this week Jamie McGrigor - a Conservative MSP - asked a question in the Scottish Parliament asking Nicola Sturgeon to honour her pledge to Dunoon by making it known by the end of August if two new ferries were to be built for the Gourock - Dunoon crossing. Sturgeon had previously committed to the two new ferries but orders were never placed. Of course such an announcement two weeks ago could have been sufficient to keep Fergusons open. As it was Sturgeon batted away the question and there's still no commitment to new ferries for that crossing.

Edited August 20, 2014 by Stuart Dickson

[FS]

The best thing the Scottish Government can do is commission a series of small and medium size ferries for Cal Mac and offer subsidies to the likes of Western Ferries and Argyll etc to upgrade their fleets, whilst supporting the vessel manufacturing industry that is left here. We will need more indigenous skills and trades in an independent country. Perhaps acquiring Ferguson's for the nation is not as daft as it seems. We are a tiny nation surrounded by water, islands and archipelagos. Surely we can do better at this game ?

[Stuart Dickson]

The best thing the Scottish Government can do is commission a series of small and medium size ferries for Cal Mac and offer subsidies to the likes of Western Ferries and Argyll etc to upgrade their fleets, whilst supporting the vessel manufacturing industry that is left here. We will need more indigenous skills and trades in an independent country. Perhaps acquiring Ferguson's for the nation is not as daft as it seems. We are a tiny nation surrounded by water, islands and archipelagos. Surely we can do better at this game ?

Absolutely.

The Scottish Government have been the yards biggest customer in recent years, so I don't know if they've decided to try to force the management at the yard out, or if they're using this as some pathetic political football. I've got to say though that a Nationalised Ship Building Yard sounds like absolutely the worst idea going.

[FS]

Why does it sound like the worst idea going ? A nationalised Prestwick Airport sounds worse to me.

[oaksoft]

If the Scottish Government was so keen to keep the yard open why did it not place another order for these ferries? The Cal Mac fleet is ageing and many crossings have had to be cancelled in recent years because of breakdowns.

Because some bastards control all of our income and limit what we can spend it on rendering us powerless to handle situations like this.

[Stuart Dickson]

Why does it sound like the worst idea going ? A nationalised Prestwick Airport sounds worse to me.

A nationalised anything sounds like the worst idea going. Honestly FS I wouldn't trust any of those politicians with my wallet never mind my taxes or my career.

[rabuddies]

The best thing the Scottish Government can do is commission a series of small and medium size ferries for Cal Mac and offer subsidies to the likes of Western Ferries and Argyll etc to upgrade their fleets, whilst supporting the vessel manufacturing industry that is left here. We will need more indigenous skills and trades in an independent country. Perhaps acquiring Ferguson's for the nation is not as daft as it seems. We are a tiny nation surrounded by water, islands and archipelagos. Surely we can do better at this game ?

Of course, they can only do this if Scotland is out of the EC. Otherwise, the Directives demand competitive tendering and, sadly, Ferguson's have been unsuccessful in getting this type of business for the last few years, apart from the 2 hybrids for CalMac. When they were awarded these contracts there was an almighty stooshie and some accusations of favouring a local bidder. It is all down to what the yard has the physical capacity and means to build and given the lack of investment over recent years it is very limited. Sad days.

[tambo]

I believe the origins of the shipyard was on the Cart when did the the move to the Clyde occur?

[Stuart Dickson]

cut

Because some bastards control all of our income and limit what we can spend it on rendering us powerless to handle situations like this.

Rubbish.

Whilst the Scottish Government were letting Cal Mac ferries age cutting off services to the islands, and starving Fergusons of the orders that it needed to keep 175 people employed they were spending £10m on a new computer system to force the 92% of schools that had been refusing to do so up till now, to place their supply purchasing online, spending £10m plus on a refit for an airport that no-one really uses, and spending £100,000's on Alex Salmond and his wife taking regular and frequent tax payer funded junkets to the USA.

[Stuart Dickson]

I believe the origins of the shipyard was on the Cart when did the the move to the Clyde occur?

1903. Their first shipyard was in Paisley. They moved to Port Glasgow when they rented the old Newark Yard.

[oaksoft]

Rubbish.

Eh?

Our entire country relies on heavily controlled handouts from Westminster limiting what we can do with it.

I think that's a pretty reasonable point.

[faraway saint]

Wrong thread..............

Edited August 20, 2014 by faraway saint

[Stuart Dickson]

Eh?

Our entire country relies on heavily controlled handouts from Westminster limiting what we can do with it.

I think that's a pretty reasonable point.

Rubbish. Salmond can waste it on whatever he likes - and he does regularly. He can also borrow against future payments, and has done to build a bridge over the River Forth. There is no reason at all why the Scottish Government couldn't have placed orders for new ferries for Cal Mac at all. Indeed Nicola Sturgeon had made a pledge to the people of Dunoon several years ago that they would get new ferries. She's failed to deliver on those pledges, and was pushed on the subject just a few days before Ferguson went into administration. They've sat on their hands for some reason. I suspect it's a blatant attempt at putting workers careers at risk to make some stupid attempt at scoring political points. It'll backfire, thats for sure

Edited August 20, 2014 by Stuart Dickson

[WeeBud]

Rubbish. Salmond can waste it on whatever he likes - and he does regularly. He can also borrow against future payments, and has done to build a bridge over the River Forth. There is no reason at all why the Scottish Government couldn't have placed orders for new ferries for Cal Mac at all. Indeed Nicola Sturgeon had made a pledge to the people of Dunoon several years ago that they would get new ferries. She's failed to deliver on those pledges, and was pushed on the subject just a few days before Ferguson went into administration. They've sat on their hands for some reason. I suspect it's a blatant attempt at putting workers careers at risk to make some stupid attempt at scoring political points. It'll backfire, thats for sure

Not quite true Stuart although without doubt something needs to be done re Dunoon/Gourock service. Several years ago would be last year and I've included a link from reasonably early on in her involvement http://forargyll.com/2013/01/deputy-first-minister-plays-a-welcome-straight-bat-over-gourock-dunoon-ferry-service/ . There has been mention of new ferries as a "long term" solution but no promises made, to my knowledge, of when they could/would/should happen but I'd be happy to be wrong.

[Stuart Dickson]

I'm watching Scottish Questions right now as Salmond talks about Fergusons. According to Dncan McNeill Cal Mac have a pressing need for TWELVE new ferries. Salmonds response was to say that the Scottish Government has already placed "substantial orders" with this yard and to praise the resilience of the workforce. He then went on to talk about the importance of preserving the workforce at Fergusons so that the company can remain a going concern - however he appears to be completely unaware of the fact that all of the apprentices at the yard have already got new jobs at Garval Clyde.

The straight answer is that the SNP Government have it in their power - and only their power - to save the yard and to retain it as a going concern and they aren't doing it.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

What improvement is proposed or needed for the gourock- dunoon service?

There is currently a passenger only ferry linking dunoon with Gourock train station and a car service with 2 or 3 vessels running depending on season from hunters quay.