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Thread To Discuss An Independent Scotland.

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It's entirely normal to want your country to make its own decisions and be politically independent.
Equally, it is entirely normal to be a passionate Scot but believe if the political system changed, the benefits and security of the Union are a benifit.

Also equally, even if you don't, it is normal to resist change.

Normal is not an acceptable substitute. Sorry!

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Equally, it is entirely normal to be a passionate Scot but believe if the political system changed, the benefits and security of the Union are a benifit.

 

Also equally, even if you don't, it is normal to resist change.

 

Normal is not an acceptable substitute. Sorry!

We've been trying to change the UK political system by voting left of centre my entire adult lifetime (I'm in my 8th decade, you know), what has that got us, BiEK? An entire adult lifetime of Tory government, most of it blue, some of it red. But still Tory.

 

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We've been trying to change the UK political system by voting left of centre my entire adult lifetime (I'm in my 8th decade, you know), what has that got us, BiEK? An entire adult lifetime of Tory government, most of it blue, some of it red. But still Tory.  
Not once during my lifetime have I felt that any vote was to change the UK political system... Just to vote in a different version of the same Londoncentric lunatics!

Things have changed now.

For example...

There is a growndswell of oponion that the House of Lords is undemocratic and should be replaced.

When has that ever been an issue before?

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Not once during my lifetime have I felt that any vote was to change the UK political system... Just to vote in a different version of the same Londoncentric lunatics!

Things have changed now.

For example...

There is a growndswell of oponion that the House of Lords is undemocratic and should be replaced.

When has that ever been an issue before?
I'm sure Labour will commit to abolishing it soon.

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Not once during my lifetime have I felt that any vote was to change the UK political system... Just to vote in a different version of the same Londoncentric lunatics!

Things have changed now.

For example...

There is a growndswell of oponion that the House of Lords is undemocratic and should be replaced.

When has that ever been an issue before?
I get where you're coming from but that groundswell has been there since I first voted in a GE over 49 years ago. Still hasn't happened - and won't while there are Tories in government.

Which of the major parties in WM has zero representation in the Lords because it believes the system is wrong so won't support it?

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I get where you're coming from but that groundswell has been there since I first voted in a GE over 49 years ago. Still hasn't happened - and won't while there are Tories in government.

Which of the major parties in WM has zero representation in the Lords because it believes the system is wrong so won't support it?
I hear you.
I agree.

That's why I feel if the same passion that was put into independence in Scotland and anti immigration in England was focused on the thing that could truly unite and make a difference in what is essentially one small island with no natural borders, change could happen.

The power to make it happen and the will is there... It's just fragmented... and that's no coincidence either!

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18 hours ago, BuddieinEK said:

Equally, it is entirely normal to be a passionate Scot but believe if the political system changed, the benefits and security of the Union are a benifit.

Also equally, even if you don't, it is normal to resist change.

Normal is not an acceptable substitute. Sorry!
emoji12.png

BTB disnae believe that first sentence.  :whistle
 

He claimed it was impossible for people like me - like you describe - to be a passionate Scot without going on independence marches and waving wee flags.

or just by living in Lovely London, within sound of the Brexit Bongs....  :P

 

 

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2 hours ago, antrin said:

BTB disnae believe that first sentence.  :whistle
 

He claimed it was impossible for people like me - like you describe - to be a passionate Scot without going on independence marches and waving wee flags.

or just by living in Lovely London, within sound of the Brexit Bongs....  :P

Erm no I said you couldn't be a proud Londoner and Scot and that your Scottishness was sentimental - you've made your choice and are able to vote in the London Mayoral elctions.

******************

I am of the opinion that Independence outweighs the benefits of the Union for Scotland. I look at BJ claiming that Brexit not prevent open trade with the rest of the world and lead to beneficial trade deals for the UK but that Scottish Independence will lead to a closed border then listen to English Tory MPs at Westminster howling at the SNP leader Ian Blackford and wonder why they want to stop us leaving, they clearly don't like us and this is the mainstream of current Tory politicians.

*******************

All of which seems to be contradicted by the Chancellors statement today that we would not be aligned with EU regulations post Brexit, so no frictionless trade with them anyway and all aboard the Train towards the 19th Century!

Edited by Bud the Baker

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On 1/16/2020 at 9:45 PM, oaksoft said:

Yes and that's the entire problem for those advocating independence. There isn't the support for it yet. Let alone nonsense about simply declaring independence.

If Yes was polling at over 70% then I'd say that simply declaring independence was the way to go bu we are probably an actual generation or more away from that sort of support.

I do agree here. Declaring independence here and now would be the wrong way to go and would only harm the Yes movement.

I agree with the second point also. I think the numbers will keep growing but the likes of 70% is not near us yet.

22 hours ago, BuddieinEK said:

Equally, it is entirely normal to be a passionate Scot but believe if the political system changed, the benefits and security of the Union are a benifit.

2014 should have been the wake up call. 45% of Scots were dissatisfied with the status quo. Long term the balance of a 5% swing isn’t much, and Westminster should have acted on that to show us the Union is worth it. Instead they’ve ignored Scotland’s MPs unless Tory, they totally ignored Scottish views on Brexit and we’ve seen absolutely no change in the treatment of Scotland.

Westminster had their chance to prove the Union was good. They had their chance to treat us as an equal. Boris’ rejection of Indyref2 should be the final straw that proves Scotland is stuck under the Westminster dictatorship.

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23 hours ago, BuddieinEK said:
On 1/17/2020 at 4:47 PM, bazil85 said:
It's the connotations that go along with the word but I feel you knew that given the "that took longer than I expected" comment. 

My question was not directed at you. Kindly piss off pants on fire boy!

No, I’m allowed to respond if I want. You were given your chance to end our engagement, you showed you desperately needed it 😁 

you’re welcome. 

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No, I’m allowed to respond if I want. You were given your chance to end our engagement, you showed you desperately needed it  

you’re welcome. 

 

You were not "responding", you were interrupting. Craving attention as always.

 

Now piss off stalker pants on fire boy.

I have no desire to hear from you. You commented on a question from me to someone else. Not to you. None of your business.

 

Now crawl back to your fantasy world and geez peace!

 

(I knew you would miss me and crumble eventually!)

 

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18 hours ago, BuddieinEK said:

 

You were not "responding", you were interrupting. Craving attention as always.

I was responding, you’re wrong again. 

Now piss off stalker pants on fire boy.

i don’t think I will thanks. This seems to annoy you as much as the FACT you’ve never once shown me lie. 😂

I have no desire to hear from you. You commented on a question from me to someone else. Not to you. None of your business.

Why should I believe you? You’ve made several such claims & haven’t once managed to stay away? Still irrelevant, I’m allowed to respond to any post I want on here. 

Now crawl back to your fantasy world and geez peace!

(I knew you would miss me and crumble eventually!)

Aw petal, good bit of reverse psychology. It’s visible for everyone to see you broke your request, not the other way around  😁

 

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