BoWSaint Posted June 8, 2014 Report Share Posted June 8, 2014 This thread is much like Scottish society in general. The silent majority - Stuart Dickson aside - stay out the discussion lest the YES campaigners - by and large abusive bully boys - vent their spleen at them. Their is so much venom, anger and rage from the yes campaigners. Very much like their UKIP counterparts down in England. Thank god its going to be a landslide no vote and the lunatics won't be taking over the asylum! Haha "leaving stuart dickson aside". He has got to be the biggest contributer and the most angry bully boy here. He completely destroys your argument and you even acknowledge it! Must try harder with your nonsense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted June 8, 2014 Report Share Posted June 8, 2014 This thread is much like Scottish society in general. The silent majority - Stuart Dickson aside - stay out the discussion lest the YES campaigners - by and large abusive bully boys - vent their spleen at them. Their is so much venom, anger and rage from the yes campaigners. Very much like their UKIP counterparts down in England. Thank god its going to be a landslide no vote and the lunatics won't be taking over the asylum! Classic deflection as usual from no, but let's not distract from the point... So not only did uk gov ask Obama to make his intervention, it also asked bbc to raise the issue at Obama's press conference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintnextlifetime Posted June 8, 2014 Report Share Posted June 8, 2014 100 days to go to the biggest day in Scottish politics for over 300 yrs. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluto Posted June 8, 2014 Report Share Posted June 8, 2014 100 days to go to the biggest day in Scottish politics for over 300 yrs. . Why will the coming NAW vote be a bigger day than the last NAW vote? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintnextlifetime Posted June 8, 2014 Report Share Posted June 8, 2014 Why will the coming NAW vote be a bigger day than the last NAW vote? When , exactly was that one. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepaisleypanda Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Why will the coming NAW vote be a bigger day than the last NAW vote? For those that don't know what happened in '79 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_devolution_referendum,_1979 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepaisleypanda Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 This thread is much like Scottish society in general. The silent majority - Stuart Dickson aside - stay out the discussion lest the YES campaigners - by and large abusive bully boys - vent their spleen at them. Their is so much venom, anger and rage from the yes campaigners. Very much like their UKIP counterparts down in England. Thank god its going to be a landslide no vote and the lunatics won't be taking over the asylum! So, what's your suggestion? Why shouldnt there be anger/ venom? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 For those that don't know what happened in '79 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_devolution_referendum,_1979 So 900,000 fewer Scots wanted devolution in 1979 than voted for James's Callaghan and Margaret Thatcher. And devolution was only moderately more popular than Margaret Thatcher in Scotland. Of course Thatcher is the woman the SNP claim Scotland didn't vote for despite her polling more votes than the SNP ever have in Scotland. I suppose using SNP logic , Scots didn't want devolution either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 (edited) So 900,000 fewer Scots wanted devolution in 1979 than voted for James's Callaghan and Margaret Thatcher. And devolution was only moderately more popular than Margaret Thatcher in Scotland. Of course Thatcher is the woman the SNP claim Scotland didn't vote for despite her polling more votes than the SNP ever have in Scotland. I suppose using SNP logic , Scots didn't want devolution either. And yet we have it now. Like I said, if there is a YES vote then 50.1% will do. If it's a NO vote it will not end there unless the YES campaign score less than 35% or so. Independence is coming. Possibly not this year but it's definitely coming. The polls all agree that excluding those who can't make up their minds only just over half the voters want to remain in the UK. For the "most successful union ever" you'd have thought at least 80% would want to remain in it. 50-60% is dire if your intention is to see the independence movement die. Edited June 9, 2014 by oaksoft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintnextlifetime Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 For those that don't know what happened in '79 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_devolution_referendum,_1979 It was a narrow yes vote that was turned into a no vote by a bit of geryymandering and the vote was for Devolution , not independence. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 And yet we have it now. Like I said, if there is a YES vote then 50.1% will do. If it's a NO vote it will not end there unless the YES campaign score less than 35% or so. Independence is coming. Possibly not this year but it's definitely coming. The polls all agree that excluding those who can't make up their minds only just over half the voters want to remain in the UK. For the "most successful union ever" you'd have thought at least 80% would want to remain in it. 50-60% is dire if your intention is to see the independence movement die. Is that 50.1% of the population, or would you be happy enough with 50.1% of the vote even if it was a really low turnout? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 (edited) There's an interesting piece on the BBC website today about undecided voters and what they were looking for to make their decision. One woman, an actress by profession, wants clarity on currency - will an Independent Scotland be using the £. Her problem, it appears to me, is that she's not reading the argument properly. Yes an Independent Scotland can use the £ if it wants - even if it's just by calling a new Scottish currency "Pound and Pence" and setting it to track Sterling exchange rates. The problem with that is that Scotland won't have control of it's currency and if you can't control your currency you can't have independence as we've all seen in the Eurozone over the past 20 years. A couple of youngsters - who will be 16 by September - complain that the arguments are being presented in too wordy a fashion. No doubt they are talking about the SNP's White Paper which has the same number of pages as a Harry Potter novel, more ridiculous fiction than anything JK Rowling could have written, and it's about as interesting as reading a dictionary from cover to cover. It's interesting the SNP thought Under 18's would help them win the referendum and then turned them off by failing to produce the kind of literature they'd be willing to read. Considering that those who are voting one way or another have become entrenched in their position, the Yes Campaign needs 100% of all undecided voters to turn out for the referendum vote and they need them all to vote Yes. they've got 100 days to do what they've failed to do so far and even then it's unlikely to be enough. Edited June 9, 2014 by Stuart Dickson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smcc Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/10801652/Nigel-Farage-hit-by-an-egg-on-campaign-trail.html I presume that this is the egg SD was talking about. As usual he gets his "facts" mixed up and, if the rest of his contributions are as good as his grasp of geography, the No camp are on a very sticky wicket indeed. I have always thought that Nottingham was in the middle of England(was that not where Robin Hood was based?). No doubt SD will blame Scots who have travelled to England just to throw eggs at Farage! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 It occurs to me that, had the vote on Independence taken place after the next Westminster election, there would be a greater likelihood of a YES outcome prevailing. There will meltdown in the run-up and subsequent to the next General Election on account of the UKIP factor, and the disintegration of the Lib Dems. Something will give, and it will be very messy indeed. I predict that, should we not secure Independence, a good number of those who voted NO will wish they hadn't once they see how things play out in the next UK wide vote. Just a hunch, and one I hope will be irrelevant, but it is a scenario I can quite imagine coming to pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isabella Duke Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 1/10 (1 for the UKIP reference - that made me smile). Hmmm. No, not biting. Haha "leaving stuart dickson aside". He has got to be the biggest contributer and the most angry bully boy here. He completely destroys your argument and you even acknowledge it! Must try harder with your nonsense. Classic deflection as usual from no, but let's not distract from the point... So, what's your suggestion? Why shouldnt there be anger/ venom? Thank guys. You have all made my point for me perfectly... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isabella Duke Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 And yet we have it now. Like I said, if there is a YES vote then 50.1% will do. If it's a NO vote it will not end there unless the YES campaign score less than 35% or so. Independence is coming. Possibly not this year but it's definitely coming. The polls all agree that excluding those who can't make up their minds only just over half the voters want to remain in the UK. For the "most successful union ever" you'd have thought at least 80% would want to remain in it. 50-60% is dire if your intention is to see the independence movement die. My intention is to see Scotland remain part of the UK. 50-60% is therefore fantastic. The only thing its dire for is the Yes campaign! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 (edited) Thank guys. You have all made my point for me perfectly... You are welcome. You clearly need all the help you can get. Edited June 9, 2014 by Drew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isabella Duke Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Stuart does raise some valid points about the popularity of Margaret Thatcher in Scotland. The Tories share of the vote in the last general election before the great Margaret came to power was 24.7%. At her last glorious general election victory in 1987 it stood at 24.0% - only marginally down. The SNP currently have a majority in the Scottish Parliament - with only 31.0% of the vote and 902,915 votes. Contrast this with Margaret Thatcher who had 31.4% of the vote in Scotland in 1979 and 916,155. It really must irk Alex Salmond that - even at his most successful - he is actually less popular in Scotland than Margaret Thatcher was! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isabella Duke Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 You are welcome. You clearly need all the help you can get. ^^^^^ you keep making my point drew... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Thank guys. You have all made my point for me perfectly... And yet there was no venom, anger or rage in the posts you quoted. Not sure how that proves your point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isabella Duke Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 FFS, is it that hard to post the truth. Well it does seem it is for some. http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0007/141379/SP-2011-electoral-data-report-WEB.pdf My apologies, I posted the wrong %. However, Salmond still achieved less votes than Margaret Thatcher did in 1979! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 ^^^^^ you keep making my point drew... Abusive? Aggressive? Dearie me, Andy, I don't recall you being such a sensitive wee soul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 It occurs to me that, had the vote on Independence taken place after the next Westminster election, there would be a greater likelihood of a YES outcome prevailing. There will meltdown in the run-up and subsequent to the next General Election on account of the UKIP factor, and the disintegration of the Lib Dems. Something will give, and it will be very messy indeed. I predict that, should we not secure Independence, a good number of those who voted NO will wish they hadn't once they see how things play out in the next UK wide vote. Just a hunch, and one I hope will be irrelevant, but it is a scenario I can quite imagine coming to pass. Nonsense. UKIP won't win a single seat in Westminster. They are just the English equivelent of the SNP. When it comes to General Elections they will be very much a minority party. The contest will be between Labour and the Conservatives. If Scotland by some miracle votes Yes in September we will have ensured a Conservative victory at Westminster and since the SNP's only proposal regarding currency is to tie Scotland to the Rest of the UK, an Independent Scotland will be consigned to follow Conservative spending plans. If Scotland votes to remain in the Union I would imagine that the next General Election vote will be tight between Conservatives and Labour. I'd imagine the next Westminster Government would have to be yet another coalition one, which given the massive success of the current coalition is no bad thing. Predictions of Armageddon in Westminster if Scotland votes No are utterly absurd, completely ridiculous, and absolute scaremongering by increasingly desperate Nationalists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 If that's the case, then f**k knows what your point is. Still no good with numbers I see. Give up ffs. ETA: Even if it was true, how can they "need" that and then "it's still unlikely to be enough". Looks like you are arguing with yourself again - you might need some medical help. ETA: Sorry, didn't mean to put "might". They need 100% of the undecided votes just to make the contest close. Even then it still may not be enough. Voters who have expressed an intention to vote one way or another are now massively entrenched. Nothing would persuade me to vote yes no, and I'm sure nothing will persuade you to vote No. With the Yes Campaign running out of time, and running out of undecided voters they look increasingly like a busted flush at around 1 in 3. That will bury Independence for a good number of years I reckon and good riddance to it too. I've got my grave dancing shoes ready for the death of Alex Salmonds political career. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smcc Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 My apologies, I posted the wrong %. However, Salmond still achieved fewer votes than Margaret Thatcher did in 1979! : And yet he still managed to get 45.4% of the votes cast. Tell me again what percentage did Mrs T get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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