I Told You Teachers Were Workshy Lazy Bastards

[StanleySaint]

I don't usually get involved in the StuD infected threads but in this case I'll ask the question, is there no professional help out there for the man?

[Liverpool Bud]

That's a really simple one to answer. I never wanted to do it, it certainly wasn't a vocation that I was ever interested in. As one of the tradesmen that I worked with when I was an apprentice once pointed out to me - if a teacher really was an expert in the subject they are teaching, they wouldn't be standing in a classroom teaching 11 - 16 year olds. They'd be out in the real world earning real money.

You are right though. I have had to deliver presentations and courses in my time. It's not an every day occurrence, but without thinking too much about it in some of my previous jobs I would deliver presentations training new recruits, in sales presentations and in safety inductions. The prep for each one of these would be exactly the same. I'd be doing it in my own time, usually in my home office and what I generally found was that apart from making minor tweaks from time to time to improve the quality of what I was doing, I could use the same presentation for that subject matter over and over again. I can't imagine why it wouldn't be the same for a teacher. Surely you aren't claiming they need to reinvent the wheel every time a new class year starts.

If you don't mind Stuart I'd like to pick you up on a few ill informed points you make?

Firstly the story of the tradesman and his theory that if someone was an expert in his subject they wouldn't be teaching..... Obviously you missed the Conservative Government recruitment drive to allow quick access for the brightest graduates to enter the profession or perhaps you were unaware of the Blairite policy of throwing money at industry to recruite some of the finest experienced leaders to share their knowledge with the next generation?

Or perhaps you'd like to ignore the professional sports people who become some of the finest sporting ambassadors or want to share their love of sport with the youth of today. Please google Ben Burgess +Hull City +Teaching

I can't imagine why you would use the same tired old presentation time after time? Sadly the Education world I know isn't like that. I'd love it if the wheel didn't have to be reinviented on what seems like an annual basis but sadly each successive Education secretary wants to put their own stamp on what is taught or courses offered. Please don't get me started on Michael Gove. Exam boards are businesses- they change the content of the course requirements of what needs studied on a regular basis - they add in modules - remove modules - add in online content - presentation that need completing. it's shifting sand it changes all the time so if you are lucky you teach a lesson once then have to alter it for the next time.

Honestly mate I could go on and on - but I won't - no-one likes a whinging teacher!

It's easy to belief you are an expert on Education just because you went to school- but the world of Education you and I experienced and the job I started in 92 is chalk and cheese ( see what I did there ?)

I don't as a rule get drawn into defending the profession I'm happy to serve but every so often I have to challenge ill informed press.

Everybody knows good and bad workers - whatever the field of employment- my wife a non teacher now is the biggest advocate of defending teachers in her office because she knows how hard good teachers like me work.

To conclude I hope some good or inspiring teachers shaped you or your families existence.

Please stick to what you do best - winding up some of the forum trolls - not teacher bashing -festive greetings!

Edited December 23, 2015 by Liverpool Bud

[smcc]

If you don't mind Stuart I'd like to pick you up on a few ill informed points you make?

Firstly the story of the tradesman and his theory that if someone was an expert in his subject they wouldn't be teaching..... Obviously you missed the Conservative Government recruitment drive to allow quick access for the brightest graduates to enter the profession or perhaps you were unaware of the Blairite policy of throwing money at industry to recruite some of the finest experienced leaders to share their knowledge with the next generation?

Or perhaps you'd like to ignore the professional sports people who become some of the finest sporting ambassadors or want to share their love of sport with the youth of today. Please google Ben Burgess +Hull City +Teaching

I can't imagine why you would use the same tired old presentation time after time? Sadly the Education world I know isn't like that. I'd love it if the wheel didn't have to be reinviented on what seems like an annual basis but sadly each successive Education secretary wants to put their own stamp on what is taught or courses offered. Please don't get me started on Michael Gove. Exam boards are businesses- they change the content of the course requirements of what needs studied on a regular basis - they add in modules - remove modules - add in online content - presentation that need completing. it's shifting sand it changes all the time so if you are lucky you teach a lesson once then have to alter it for the next time.

Honestly mate I could go on and on - but I won't - no-one likes a whinging teacher!

It's easy to belief you are an expert on Education just because you went to school- but the world of Education you and I experienced and the job I started in 92 is chalk and cheese ( see what I did there ?)

I don't as a rule get drawn into defending the profession I'm happy to serve but every so often I have to challenge ill informed press.

Everybody knows good and bad workers - whatever the field of employment- my wife a non teacher now is the biggest advocate of defending teachers in her office because she knows how hard good teachers like me work.

To conclude I hope some good or inspiring teachers shaped you or your families existence.

Please stick to what you do best - winding up some of the forum trolls - not teacher bashing -festive greetings!

Only one thing wrong with this post. Stu D is the forum troll par excellence.

[pozbaird]

Only one thing wrong with this post. Stu D is the forum troll par excellence.

Still gets bites though. You have to admire his indefagability.

[bluto]

Still gets bites though. You have to admire his indefagability.

Nah....

It's all down to other's gullibility....

[FTOF]

Nah....

It's all down to other's gullibility....

Indeed.

Particularly the gullibility of people who think that he's intelligent enough to be purposely trolling all of the time.

[Stuart Dickson]

If you don't mind Stuart I'd like to pick you up on a few ill informed points you make?

Firstly the story of the tradesman and his theory that if someone was an expert in his subject they wouldn't be teaching..... Obviously you missed the Conservative Government recruitment drive to allow quick access for the brightest graduates to enter the profession or perhaps you were unaware of the Blairite policy of throwing money at industry to recruite some of the finest experienced leaders to share their knowledge with the next generation?

Or perhaps you'd like to ignore the professional sports people who become some of the finest sporting ambassadors or want to share their love of sport with the youth of today. Please google Ben Burgess +Hull City +Teaching

I can't imagine why you would use the same tired old presentation time after time? Sadly the Education world I know isn't like that. I'd love it if the wheel didn't have to be reinviented on what seems like an annual basis but sadly each successive Education secretary wants to put their own stamp on what is taught or courses offered. Please don't get me started on Michael Gove. Exam boards are businesses- they change the content of the course requirements of what needs studied on a regular basis - they add in modules - remove modules - add in online content - presentation that need completing. it's shifting sand it changes all the time so if you are lucky you teach a lesson once then have to alter it for the next time.

Honestly mate I could go on and on - but I won't - no-one likes a whinging teacher!

It's easy to belief you are an expert on Education just because you went to school- but the world of Education you and I experienced and the job I started in 92 is chalk and cheese ( see what I did there ?)

I don't as a rule get drawn into defending the profession I'm happy to serve but every so often I have to challenge ill informed press.

Everybody knows good and bad workers - whatever the field of employment- my wife a non teacher now is the biggest advocate of defending teachers in her office because she knows how hard good teachers like me work.

To conclude I hope some good or inspiring teachers shaped you or your families existence.

Please stick to what you do best - winding up some of the forum trolls - not teacher bashing -festive greetings!

Ben Burgess - his example actually backs me up. Think about it. He's 30 years old. He's moved from Hull City to Tranmere on a massive downward spiral. His knees are f**ked and he's not played a single match in the first three months of the season. There's no question he was a decent footballer in his day but now because of injury he's struggling to play matches. He studies to become a teacher. His expertise is in football. He's also studied to be a football journalist. Is he teaching any of those subjects? No, he's teaching under 10's in a primary school. Now if he was still fit, he'd still be playing football. He's still be in the real world earning real money but that career door was closing on him, so he's gone into teaching - a profession where he can no doubt enjoy continuing to work part time hours, with long off season periods.

I also find your comments about having to change what you teach depending on what the exam questions are going to be more than a bit bizarre. Lets take an example just to illustrate my point. Lets say you are a Maths teacher. Regardless of what the Education Secretary decides to do with the exam structure or the way the course is marked, Calculus is still the same, trigonometry is still the same - there's no need to change how you teach it just so long as your pupils learn it. To that end repeating the same presentation that works, over and over again, should never be an issue. Each child coming through will have seen it for the first time, so the only person you are entertaining by changing your presentation is yourself. Indeed it could be argued that you are experimenting with each group of children you present your new presentation to for the first time.

I dare say there are some good teachers out there. Maybe you are one. But we still come back to the original point where it has been reported that sickness levels amongst Scottish School teachers are amongst the worst in any sector of employment, and the highest reported cause is stress. Stress? In a job where you work for 22.5 hours per week and you have more holidays than any one else in the country. That is workshy in any definition.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

Shhh you. I'm talking about money. You natsi's have no clue about money, economics, finance or anything like that.

Unlike those clever Tories. How are Gideon's forecasts working out with regards finance. You know borrowing and stuff like that?

[salmonbuddie]

And dancing, don't forget dancing. Did Gideon forecast the downturn in dancing in Scotland?

[Guest TPAFKATS]

And dancing, don't forget dancing. Did Gideon forecast the downturn in dancing in Scotland?

Has he ever forecast anything correctly?

[Liverpool Bud]

Evening Stuart

Thank you for taking the time to google Ben Burgess and twist the facts to suit your muted point.

I'm sure Ben would fully agree with you - a young man in his 30's who has over a decade as a top flight player who has bags of life experience and expertise to share with young people. A guy who could of gone down the pundit route or joined the old boys gravy train but instead chose to retrain and work with young people - possibly something he will enjoy doing for the remaining 35 years of his working life.

Sadly your ignorance of teaching methods, styles and pedogy is highlighted in your lack of knowledge - yes calculus - dates in history - of mice and men - lay up shots in basketball - population in Bangladesh and every other topic on every subject remains the same but how it is taught continually evolves.

Anyway as I posted previously I don't generally get drawn into low level pub debate on how typically lazy teachers are.

I'm secure in the fact that the young people under my Pastoral care and tutorage get a good deal.

Remember if it's such an easy way to make a living it's probably not to late for you to retrain.

Finally mate - this is a topic that could be debated all day - but not by me - teaching is not a 22hour a week profession - I don't know why Scottish teachers seem to have the reported levels of stress - just be thankful that hard working teachers have given you and yours a platform to become successful in their chosen field!

I won't be posting any more on this topic as its Christmas and I'm enjoying relaxing and spending time with my family - I'm only online because I can't watch any more bloody Masterchef!

Have a pleasant Christmas

[salmonbuddie]

There's only one question left after that, Liverpool Bud - who won Masterchef, then?

Edited December 23, 2015 by salmonbuddie

[salmonbuddie]

Has he ever forecast anything correctly?

That's another one of those "rhetorical" questions, answer it yourself!

[Liverpool Bud]

There's only one question left after that, Liverpool Bud - who won Masterchef, then?

No I mean my wife watches each episode of Masterchef - I can't abide it - I've no idea - is it even the final?

[Stuart Dickson]

Evening Stuart

Thank you for taking the time to google Ben Burgess and twist the facts to suit your muted point.

I'm sure Ben would fully agree with you - a young man in his 30's who has over a decade as a top flight player who has bags of life experience and expertise to share with young people. A guy who could of gone down the pundit route or joined the old boys gravy train but instead chose to retrain and work with young people - possibly something he will enjoy doing for the remaining 35 years of his working life.

Sadly your ignorance of teaching methods, styles and pedogy is highlighted in your lack of knowledge - yes calculus - dates in history - of mice and men - lay up shots in basketball - population in Bangladesh and every other topic on every subject remains the same but how it is taught continually evolves.

Anyway as I posted previously I don't generally get drawn into low level pub debate on how typically lazy teachers are.

I'm secure in the fact that the young people under my Pastoral care and tutorage get a good deal.

Remember if it's such an easy way to make a living it's probably not to late for you to retrain.

Finally mate - this is a topic that could be debated all day - but not by me - teaching is not a 22hour a week profession - I don't know why Scottish teachers seem to have the reported levels of stress - just be thankful that hard working teachers have given you and yours a platform to become successful in their chosen field!

I won't be posting any more on this topic as its Christmas and I'm enjoying relaxing and spending time with my family - I'm only online because I can't watch any more bloody Masterchef!

Have a pleasant Christmas

Ben Burgess also works as a radio pundit / summeriser for BBC Radio Lancashire covering Blackpool FC home matches - so I guess he is still on the gravy train....topping up his income from his part time post as a teacher.

You made me chuckle at the life experience bit too, but then I thought about it. Yep why not. I suppose sheltered and pampered professional footballers from the English Premiership would look like they had bags of life experience to a school teacher....

Happy Christmas.

[salmonbuddie]

No I mean my wife watches each episode of Masterchef - I can't abide it - I've no idea - is it even the final?

I've no idea either, just thought I'd throw that in there to put Stud off a bit - seems to have worked!

[bluto]

And yet.... and yet.... You all still give him things to which he can respond.

He cannot thrive without you.

Learn, FFS.

[bluto]

Aye, but...

The rest of us have to wade through the morass of responses, then hiss (sic) replies to them, in order to excavate the odd gem.

It's really limiting in terms of fun.

[bluto]

Then go to the cinema. (© Wee Gus)

I do.

I DO!!

HERE, Here's where I hope to tune out...

(Star Wars ramorra. For the umpteenth time. )

[Stuart Dickson]

That shows how much you know about maths - the sqrt of f**k all.

As for the rest of the sick leave and hours worked stuff, you've already been shown to be wrong so why do you insist on repeating it? I mean, everyone knows you are a thick c**t, you don't have to keep proving it.

Ach well, ok then. You're right. Teachers aren't workshy lazy bastards. They really do have an extremely stressful job. Shame on the SNP for putting them under so much pressure.

[oaksoft]

to work out the value of a job to our society simply remove it and consider what the impact would be.

where would society be without teachers?

where would the next generation of scientists, doctors, engineers, nurses, bankers, etc come from?

we know dickson is filled with hate for things which have personally hurt him. the board of directors of our club know all about that.

maybe he thinks teachers failed him? he is still trying to pretend that the link he provided says teachers have a 22.5 hour working week when in fact it says 35 hours.

anyway wgas. merry christmas folks and ffs give Spectre a miss.

[Stuart Dickson]

to work out the value of a job to our society simply remove it and consider what the impact would be.

where would society be without teachers?

where would the next generation of scientists, doctors, engineers, nurses, bankers, etc come from?

we know dickson is filled with hate for things which have personally hurt him. the board of directors of our club know all about that.

maybe he thinks teachers failed him? he is still trying to pretend that the link he provided says teachers have a 22.5 hour working week when in fact it says 35 hours.

anyway wgas. merry christmas folks and ffs give Spectre a miss.

Similarly, remove pipefitters and you are living in a country without a water supply, without a sewage system, without an oil or gas industry, without nuclear power plants, and ultimately of course without electricity

I'm not advocating the extermination of teachers. I'm not even hinting at it. All I suggested was that there should be a standardisation of local authority employment contracts and that teachers should have to work a proper full time shift for a full time wage. Spending "a maximum" of 22.5 hours teaching per week, with 40 days annual holiday is hardly a full time job - and it really does beg the question why, if they aren't work shy lazy bastards, are so many of the f**kers spending so much time off work with "stress"?

[Stuart Dickson]

So how many hours a week do you suggest is full time work? How many paid holidays should a worker get? Who should decide if someone is suffering from stress (or anything else, for that matter)?

As for pipefitters, we'd just get plumbers to do it. A pipefitter is, essentially, just a plumber who works on bigger pipes.

The UK government determines that a full time worker will usually work 35 hours or more per week. That definition is on their website. On the same website it stipulates that most workers who work a 5 day week must receive 28 days paid annual leave days per year. Since we live in the UK and UK taxpayers are paying for our teachers I reckon it's only fair we use the UK Governments definitions - don't you?

And its perfectly clear you don't have a clue either about plumbing or pipefitting. Do you really think push fit fittings, silver soldered joints and brazed joints would be able to handle the kind of pressures seen - for example - in a nuclear plants pipework? Had we gone down that route the SNP would have gotten it's wish by now and Scotland really would be a deserted, toxic, barren wasteland. Thankfully we have our hero pipefitters, and thankfully 55% of Scots were patriotic enough to see the SNP for what they were trying to do and we rejected "Independence". Scotland flourishes and thrives.....all, it seems, apart from these teachers who get so stressed out at having to spend a maximum of 4.5 hours a day working with children.

Edited December 24, 2015 by Stuart Dickson

[salmonbuddie]

Says the plumber....

[Ayrshire Saints]

We were just sitting over a mince pie and coffee there listening to the radio in the office (beats working eh ?) and it sprang to mind how SD must really detest radio DJ's. These guys roll in, speak for a couple of hours and that's their day over. Well paid too at the top level. Wonder if they are on a salary or only paid for the hours they speak (2-3 a day on average). That damned private sector - money for old rope !!!