ktf

If there are any individual politicians who are Saints fans, and want to get on board - they're as welcome to an individual CIC monthly membership, an 87club membership, or an 1877club membership as a Saints fan who is an electrician, accountant, bus driver, whatever. Seeing some sort of organised council involvement is worrying. 10 foot bargepole required.

You're right. There is scope for political groups to be involved in football. To boost the interest and think seriously about grad-roots involvement. However, a political party/group should never own a football club.
They are a transient group and the people who are there today will not be in 5 years time. What happens if the council leader hates football or is more interested in, oh I don't I know, making the High Street more attractive to retailers or is a m*rton/C*ltic/yeolder*ngers fan and has no interest in diverting council money to keep the club afloat during tough times?
It's incredible that some people have been critical of the CiC an REA and then rejoice at this nonsense!

You're right. There is scope for political groups to be involved in football. To boost the interest and think seriously about grad-roots involvement. However, a political party/group should never own a football club.
They are a transient group and the people who are there today will not be in 5 years time. What happens if the council leader hates football or is more interested in, oh I don't I know, making the High Street more attractive to retailers or is a m*rton/C*ltic/yeolder*ngers fan and has no interest in diverting council money to keep the club afloat during tough times?
It's incredible that some people have been critical of the CiC an REA and then rejoice at this nonsense!

You're right. There is scope for political groups to be involved in football. To boost the interest and think seriously about grad-roots involvement. However, a political party/group should never own a football club.
They are a transient group and the people who are there today will not be in 5 years time. What happens if the council leader hates football or is more interested in, oh I don't I know, making the High Street more attractive to retailers or is a m*rton/C*ltic/yeolder*ngers fan and has no interest in diverting council money to keep the club afloat during tough times?
It's incredible that some people have been critical of the CiC an REA and then rejoice at this nonsense!

They(politicians) are disgusting creatures. Lets face it, they are third rate people with first rate egos and are almost to a man and woman, financially illiterate morons with no experience of business. I REALLY don't want these utter dangerous failures anywhere near our club.
I have absolutely no idea about the chicanery that went on with the first model CiC, but I did hear the rumours, no idea whether they are right or wrong, but it kind of makes sense now.
Absolutely disgusting people, they should be swinging from the lamp posts.

Ooh this is good news. The stadium and training grounds to be owned by the council and St Mirren can get a shot so long as their serial lets are approved. Oh so it might cost £hundreds per session but the club will be able to save money by dumping Tommy Docherty cause Paisleys Parks and Recreactions team can cut and line the pitches instead.
I cant see a downside to any of this at all. Juvenile clubs need better facilities and what could be a better use of council tax payers resources than buying up a couple of pitches for the Mossjams and Linwood Rangers to play on

Anyone that truly thinks having politicians anything to do with the football club is a complete and utter bellend. Get this particular idea to f**k along with the politicians and their nonsense.
We honestly have folk on here worrying about the character of Richard Atkinson and then welcoming a bunch of backstabbing lying, thick, troughing nonentities that have failed in their lives to run our club?
Yeah, great idea.

If you read Brian Lawson's statement, it's pretty clear! They have no interest in funding the CiC. They have been dead against it since the start - actively working to see it fail. It was SNP's intervention that brought down CiC1.
The will categorically not get involved with the CiC, if they progress with this hair-brained idea it will be a rival bid. There will be no fan involvement and the club will be run on political agendas. The nature of the CiC means that it will attracts investment and over time the revenue streams will increase. There will be no option for that under these plans. This is quite probably the worst possible thing that can happen to our club!
And besides, the council are labour led now, not SNP, so I don't even see how they could actually manage this.

The tone. The cheap shot.
If you can represent your concerns without the need to resort to personalised attacks based on assumptions and speculation, then people might be more inclined to address them, I'd have thought.

You (10000 hours) were at pains to tell us today that the questions were there for debate and reaction, inferring that they could be changed if opinion was for that.
But you chose to go with them anyway in the face of a significant response indicating they did not sit right with the support and the context of what was being debated. Your choice at the end of the day but not great as a first consultation excercise with the membership.
Why insist the questions were up for change/debate if you had decided to go with them anyway?

To be fair, I kind of agree with you here. I understand the reasoning behind the outgoing BOD wanting to work alongside 10000hours on canvassing opinion - but I absolutely agree with you in regard to making the issues as clear as possible, and not to further muddy the waters - which in this case are already exceedingly muddy.
Drew (I think) seems to have got it right. As a BOD, as a club - Vlad has lead the way, the Arabs, Hibs and others have followed. Just feckin' say NO too - because it is the right thing to do anyway.
We need to move on and start portraying St Mirren and the CIC as a positive thing - on its own merits.

I'm sorry but these questions are loaded and quite frankly very disappointing. I had expected information upon which to base my decision, not baseless rhetoric that allows no-one to make an informed decision.
I am abstaining from this vote.

It matters because there are two sides to this sorry saga. I have never doubted for one moment that the loss of one of our biggest clubs causes financial problems. It causes undeniable loss in visiting fan numbers, it causes uncertainty over the TV deal, it possibly causes CK concern with selling corporate tables less easily, it causes less business for the likes of the Buddie Good Food van, it causes possibly hundreds of Ibrox employees to be on edge over their jobs / mortgages.... I could go on.
It would be exactly the same if this was Porto or Benfica - take emotion out if it, the facts are a smallish country losing one of two disproportionally large clubs causes problems. My problem is that I haven't a scooby-doo how severe the financial problem is, I am being given zero facts about the severity of the financial implications, yet I am being given emotive language about how scary it is, and am being asked to vote 'Yes' or 'No' to this Newco malarky.
Whether I am entrenched in my 'No' position is a side-issue. If you want us to vote on something which is a Yes or No issue, give us something tangible to chew over in regard to the 'Yes' option. I'm absolutely with ktf. If the questions go out as first mooted on here - I'm abstaining.
In regard to the CIC getting more income - I'm all for that, but the Rangers Zombie Dawn of the Dead Newco FC issue isn't a cause on which to seemingly attempt some fundraising. I bought into the concept of the CIC as being something positive - an antidote indeed to the sugar daddy ownership model such as Gretna, Livingston or the soon to be deceased Rangers.
More income for the CIC should be generated because more and more St Mirren minded people are convinced that it is right, that it is positive, and that it genuinely is the best way forward after a long period under the outgoing BOD. People shouldn't be encouraged to pump more of their hard-earned into it because Rangers are fcuked.

No, what you've done is mix up two things into one. We can only speculate why you've done that but if this was how the independence referendum question was structured you'd have the electoral commission down your throat.
All you needed to do was place your concerns in a list and then ask a simple question:-
Based on the info above, should this NewCo be voted straight into the SPL to take over from Rangers?
We're not idiots and treating us like we are is likely to annoy people.

I'm sorry but these questions are loaded and quite frankly very disappointing. I had expected information upon which to base my decision, not baseless rhetoric that allows no-one to make an informed decision.
I am abstaining from this vote.

I'm sorry but these questions are loaded and quite frankly very disappointing. I had expected information upon which to base my decision, not baseless rhetoric that allows no-one to make an informed decision.
I am abstaining from this vote.

I'm sorry but these questions are loaded and quite frankly very disappointing. I had expected information upon which to base my decision, not baseless rhetoric that allows no-one to make an informed decision.
I am abstaining from this vote.

How can anybody tell you anything to your face when you're an anonymous alias?

It would appear that spending endless hours on B&W Army trolling, is the preferred starting point for alternatives to the CiC.

Forum clown...

It's downright disgraceful how Div has been treated on these forums. Oaksoft, Sid, Chic appearing out of nowhere with once of his many aliases, and other too - you know who you are.
Div has and continues to work tirelessly for the St Mirren community (got that now Sid) and has decided that he is in favour of the 10000 Hours bid. Because of these two things he has been a bit more involved at this stage than others have - is that any reason to accuse him of lies?
Some people on here need to take a long hard look at themselves and think seriously before posting another thing on this site. Some of the things levelle at Div have been downright disgusting!

It's downright disgraceful how Div has been treated on these forums. Oaksoft, Sid, Chic appearing out of nowhere with once of his many aliases, and other too - you know who you are.
Div has and continues to work tirelessly for the St Mirren community (got that now Sid) and has decided that he is in favour of the 10000 Hours bid. Because of these two things he has been a bit more involved at this stage than others have - is that any reason to accuse him of lies?
Some people on here need to take a long hard look at themselves and think seriously before posting another thing on this site. Some of the things levelle at Div have been downright disgusting!

It's downright disgraceful how Div has been treated on these forums. Oaksoft, Sid, Chic appearing out of nowhere with once of his many aliases, and other too - you know who you are.
Div has and continues to work tirelessly for the St Mirren community (got that now Sid) and has decided that he is in favour of the 10000 Hours bid. Because of these two things he has been a bit more involved at this stage than others have - is that any reason to accuse him of lies?
Some people on here need to take a long hard look at themselves and think seriously before posting another thing on this site. Some of the things levelle at Div have been downright disgusting!

It's downright disgraceful how Div has been treated on these forums. Oaksoft, Sid, Chic appearing out of nowhere with once of his many aliases, and other too - you know who you are.
Div has and continues to work tirelessly for the St Mirren community (got that now Sid) and has decided that he is in favour of the 10000 Hours bid. Because of these two things he has been a bit more involved at this stage than others have - is that any reason to accuse him of lies?
Some people on here need to take a long hard look at themselves and think seriously before posting another thing on this site. Some of the things levelle at Div have been downright disgusting!

I find it incredible that I am called a "scaremongering dick" for posting hard and cold facts from another SPL club who are trying to educate and inform their fans about the potential implications significant changes in SPL revenues would have on their club.
These facts come from their board of directors.
I posted these facts because I was called a scaremongering dick for daring to suggest that St.Mirren would face similar challenges.
Apparently if you don't agree with something these days, even when it is supported by compelling evidence, the best option is to resort to some personal abuse.