10000Hours Online Direct Debits Live

[Bud the Baker]

I know they've probably got more intelligent fans than St Mirren

The main drag on the average IQ of Saints fans is you.

[St. Sid]

Fraser, seriously, were you ever taken in by that shite? The consortium was always going to sell to the highest bidder, and I reckon the desperation to shift the shares ASAP is because of the financial uncertainty surrounding the SPL and the whole Newco Rangers stuff anyway. There is a real possibility that the SFA could suspend Rangers membership next week, and if they do it could have massive financial implications for St Mirren FC - it certainly would have massive implications in terms of the value of the 52% shareholding within the club.

The two bids - if they exist - could be absolutely anything. It could be a muiti billionaire Arab sheik coming in with a desire to make St Mirren European Champions Cup Winners in the next 3 years, or it could be someone fronting for a possible Rangers Newco option in the style of Airdrie United, just incase they need it. However one thing is crystal clear - the fans comfort blanket - Gilmour - won't be in charge for much longer.

10000hours is what it is. It looks like a good idea to me. The business model has worked well elsewhere in Scotland and across Europe. I know they've probably got more intelligent fans than St Mirren but I don't think that's a factor here. Where fans are at now is they either back something that has been explained to them, or they don't and they take their chance with whomever the consortium chooses to sell too. There's no wrong answer. As Sid says it's a personal choice. Good luck..

Not much was explained Stu. It was the same pitch you saw at previous meetings. It is still very much a leap of faith. One chap from a community group did ask about the community groups roles in the CIC. It is pretty much what we covered in a few posts earlier in the week. They have ordinary memberships and the Social investment is the same slide we saw previously - a requirement for the social funder.

[Bud the Baker]

Have to say I'm with the cynics on this - if the CIC can swing the £7.5k p/m to pay off Bii then the Consortium will take whatever money is available and run.

It is proving difficult to persuade individuals to commit to the £25k membership tier in the current climate but talks are ongoing.

Individual subs will repay the £500k borrowing. The 87 club @ £3k will generate £250k, Gordons shares make up the rest.

The numbers have never added up IMO - just to pick on one point how do GLS's shares which he can't sell "make up the rest" but the one point on which I agree with StuDick on is that the Consortium are desperate to sell. Good luck to the CIC but I won't be joining and if the two bids being alluded to turn out to be real then I suppose it'll be brandy & cigars for the Consortium and a red face for me.

[santaponsasaint]

Have to say I'm with the cynics on this - if the CIC can swing the £7.5k p/m to pay off Bii then the Consortium will take whatever money is available and run.

The numbers have never added up IMO - just to pick on one point how do GLS's shares which he can't sell "make up the rest" but the one point on which I agree with StuDick on is that the Consortium are desperate to sell. Good luck to the CIC but I won't be joining and if the two bids being alluded to turn out to be real then I suppose it'll be brandy & cigars for the Consortium and a red face for me.

Heres a mad idea, go to the meetings and discuss it with RA, instead spreading doubt from behind a keyboard, im sure RA will be delighted to have a chat with you

[Bud the Baker]

Heres a mad idea,

I'm sure you've got plenty of them.

[Big Fras]

Heres a mad idea, go to the meetings and discuss it with RA, instead spreading doubt from behind a keyboard, im sure RA will be delighted to have a chat with you

Gary, Bud the Baker didn't actually say anything about Richard / CiC.

I like the ideas of fan ownership, it's just that from what we are seeing, our involvement gets us a membership of the firm that owns St.Mirren, and our payments are key to paying off the old BoD. I had a utopic vision of 2,000 Buds all paying monthly subs, and owning the club, not a share of the firm that owns it. The supporters DDs are being chased up with vigour, but I cannot see how much a say we will have in things. If we are really THAT important, then surely we have a place on the BoD; a veto power; etc.

The idea of paying out for this before you know what it actually all entails is ludicrous. Which is what Sid was saying , ..............which is exactly why I need a lie down, and tending to by Emily Maitliss and Susanna Reid in revealing towelling robes, each with the tattoo FTOF in a "delicate area".

I may be dreaming, but I think some others on here are as well. SG said he'd never sell to anyone who didn't have SMFC's intersts at heart.................we should all hold him to this

[dave.j]

Not much was explained Stu. It was the same pitch you saw at previous meetings. It is still very much a leap of faith. One chap from a community group did ask about the community groups roles in the CIC. It is pretty much what we covered in a few posts earlier in the week. They have ordinary memberships and the Social investment is the same slide we saw previously - a requirement for the social funder.

Leap of faith? ;-)

[Isle Of Bute Saint]

First meeting I have been to which is some ways I enjoyed and some i did not.

Why on earth did a couple of SMISA members think they were being hammered. Watching from the side lines it did not seem to me SMISA got hammerd. Thought Richard explained the three points very well. It also looked to me that some SMISA members have made up their mind not to join no matter what was said.

Strange as what is on offer is what SMISA has always wanted fan power. Here is hoping SMISA members back this take over because the alternative in reality is not what the fans want.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

Heres a mad idea, go to the meetings and discuss it with RA, instead spreading doubt from behind a keyboard, im sure RA will be delighted to have a chat with you

Not spreading doubt but hasnt there been a number of meetings and a number of discussion threads and comments from RA on the subject

[Guest TPAFKATS]

First meeting I have been to which is some ways I enjoyed and some i did not.

Why on earth did a couple of SMISA members think they were being hammered. Watching from the side lines it did not seem to me SMISA got hammerd. Thought Richard explained the three points very well. It also looked to me that some SMISA members have made up their mind not to join no matter what was said.

Strange as what is on offer is what SMISA has always wanted fan power. Here is hoping SMISA members back this take over because the alternative in reality is not what the fans want.

What is this alternative that we dont want?

[Isle Of Bute Saint]

Gary, Bud the Baker didn't actually say anything about Richard / CiC.

I like the ideas of fan ownership, it's just that from what we are seeing, our involvement gets us a membership of the firm that owns St.Mirren, and our payments are key to paying off the old BoD. I had a utopic vision of 2,000 Buds all paying monthly subs, and owning the club, not a share of the firm that owns it. The supporters DDs are being chased up with vigour, but I cannot see how much a say we will have in things. If we are really THAT important, then surely we have a place on the BoD; a veto power; etc.

The idea of paying out for this before you know what it actually all entails is ludicrous. Which is what Sid was saying , ..............which is exactly why I need a lie down, and tending to by Emily Maitliss and Susanna Reid in revealing towelling robes, each with the tattoo FTOF in a "delicate area".

I may be dreaming, but I think some others on here are as well. SG said he'd never sell to anyone who didn't have SMFC's intersts at heart.................we should all hold him to this

Fras Sid asked a question which I thought was answerd. If it was not the answer he was looking for then he should have pushed on.

Honestly I am flabbergasted some of you are dragging your heels on this opportunity it's as if ears are filled with cotton wool and eye's are completely blind folded. Sad

[Bud the Baker]

One risk doesn't nullify another risk Bud. Like I say, it is decision time now. I am not going to try and talk anyone one out of singing up. The consortium / 10000 Hours have put a deadline in place and fans need to decide what is best for them. Fans are not responsible for the deadline. However, we will be forced to decide one way or another as a result of it. Not a time to be ramming views down people's throats. It one thing drumming up interest, a very different thing trying to influence such an important decision for the club's future. The CIC might be great it might not - but no one should be making decisions for other people at this point.

Let people make their own minds up based on the information available to them.

Message to santaponsasaint who liked this post - I have.

[santaponsasaint]

Gary, Bud the Baker didn't actually say anything about Richard / CiC.

I like the ideas of fan ownership, it's just that from what we are seeing, our involvement gets us a membership of the firm that owns St.Mirren, and our payments are key to paying off the old BoD. I had a utopic vision of 2,000 Buds all paying monthly subs, and owning the club, not a share of the firm that owns it. The supporters DDs are being chased up with vigour, but I cannot see how much a say we will have in things. If we are really THAT important, then surely we have a place on the BoD; a veto power; etc.

The idea of paying out for this before you know what it actually all entails is ludicrous. Which is what Sid was saying , ..............which is exactly why I need a lie down, and tending to by Emily Maitliss and Susanna Reid in revealing towelling robes, each with the tattoo FTOF in a "delicate area".

I may be dreaming, but I think some others on here are as well. SG said he'd never sell to anyone who didn't have SMFC's intersts at heart.................we should all hold him to this

He said the figures dont add up, i wasnt slagging him, i said have a chat with RA thats all

[Stuart Dickson]

Not much was explained Stu. It was the same pitch you saw at previous meetings. It is still very much a leap of faith. One chap from a community group did ask about the community groups roles in the CIC. It is pretty much what we covered in a few posts earlier in the week. They have ordinary memberships and the Social investment is the same slide we saw previously - a requirement for the social funder.

Sid, that's a shame cause I would have liked to have had a better understanding of just how 10000hours proposes it will help community groups. At the start of this whole process I went to a Wishaw Wycombe exec meeting and tried to get them to sanction a £500 spend to join on the basis of the initial proposal. I got a very lukewarm response then especially when I tried to get info from REA about what could be included in an MOU and discovered that actually nothing could be confirmed until the takeover had happened and a new SMFC board was in place. It was very much a leap of faith back then and it was one our club couldn't afford and to be perfectly honest I wasn't prepared to fund out of my own pocket.

Now the situation is that it's a tenner a month and if we sign up and we don't get an MOU that the club feels offers value we can stop the payments straight away. It's a much better punt for a community group that likes to spend every penny of cash it gets in on facilities, coach ed, kit and equipment for kids. I appreciate that the risk for St Mirren FC lies in members cancelling direct debits but from the community group point of view you have to say the risk has been dramatically reduced and it should be much easier for 10000hours to offer something that makes membership feel worth more than what the community group are paying out.

I've outlined in the past how I think community football clubs could be assisted by 10000hours and I've shown how that could have a massive benefit return for SMFC. In my head it makes complete sense but if it doesn't work the way it does in my head then what have I lost? £30 - £40 and maybe a bit of face in front of the Wishaw Wycombe committee? I can handle that.

[Isle Of Bute Saint]

What is this alternative that we dont want?

There are two bids which you can read about tomorrow in the hearld. Nobody could say who they are from. However between the lines it looks as though might be from a former livi owner. I'm guessing. But money would have to be loaned and paid back nobody is going to put their own cash up front. So who is going to pay back the loan ? The club of course which will affect our budget. Read the Herald tomorrow

[Guest TPAFKATS]

Gary, Bud the Baker didn't actually say anything about Richard / CiC.

I like the ideas of fan ownership, it's just that from what we are seeing, our involvement gets us a membership of the firm that owns St.Mirren, and our payments are key to paying off the old BoD. I had a utopic vision of 2,000 Buds all paying monthly subs, and owning the club, not a share of the firm that owns it. The supporters DDs are being chased up with vigour, but I cannot see how much a say we will have in things. If we are really THAT important, then surely we have a place on the BoD; a veto power; etc.

The idea of paying out for this before you know what it actually all entails is ludicrous. Which is what Sid was saying , ..............which is exactly why I need a lie down, and tending to by Emily Maitliss and Susanna Reid in revealing towelling robes, each with the tattoo FTOF in a "delicate area".

I may be dreaming, but I think some others on here are as well. SG said he'd never sell to anyone who didn't have SMFC's intersts at heart.................we should all hold him to this

I am a shareholder, however it would appear that I will have no more say in the club than I currently have under this arrangement. It will however cost me an extra £120 a year on top of whatever I currently spent on St.Mirren. Is that too simplistic?

Does anyone want to buy my shares - current CIC value of course

[Guest TPAFKATS]

There are two bids which you can read about tomorrow in the hearld. Nobody could say who they are from. However between the lines it looks as though might be from a former livi owner. I'm guessing. But money would have to be loaned and paid back nobody is going to put their own cash up front. So who is going to pay back the loan ? The club of course which will affect our budget. Read the Herald tomorrow

No need to worry about former livi owners - the consortium wont sell to anyone without SMFC's best interests at heart

ETA - if nobody can say who they are from I guess unless the herald reveals it as an exclusive then we don't know if its an alternative that we don't want

Edited June 7, 2012 by TPAFKATS

[dave.j]

No need to worry about former livi owners - the consortium wont sell to anyone without SMFC's best interests at heart

Tony, is it just fan ownership in general you are against? Or is it just the specific CIC model you disagree with?

[Isle Of Bute Saint]

Clearly some work needs to be done for the share holders they did help out in the clubs our of need. but that up to the share holders to contact Richard who will explain what can be done for you.

When the loans are paid I\m sure we could keep the direct debit going until we buy all shares for the CIC.

[Bud the Baker]

He said the figures dont add up, i wasnt slagging him, i said have a chat with RA thats all

I have exchanged emails with him, read the CiC info, asked him some more questions via the 10000hours website, paid close attention to the information posted about the CIC meetings and come to my decision - it's not for me.

********************************

I have a degree of admiration for the guys signing up @ £10p/m - if the estimate of 8 years to pay off the debt is correct then that's a grand committment - and AFAIK that's before GLS gets his slice.

Hopefully these should be my final words on the matter.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

Tony, is it just fan ownership in general you are against? Or is it just the specific CIC model you disagree with?

dave I am all for fan ownership.

I want to get behind SMFC going down this route.

I am not convinced that the model that has been presented to us is genuinely fan ownership.

At the moment there is a lot of spin and emotional blackmail to get the fans to sign up to something that IMo appears to benefit only those wishing to sell their shares.

[Bud the Baker]

Clearly some work needs to be done for the share holders they did help out in the clubs our of need. but that up to the share holders to contact Richard who will explain what can be done for you.

When the loans are paid I\m sure we could keep the direct debit going until we buy all shares for the CIC.

......until I read this post - you're the second CICer who's made this suggestion in the past couple of days.

I don't want to sell my shares!

unlike the Consortium & GLS I'm not looking for my money back.

.

[Grumpy Old Fan]

No need to worry about former livi owners - the consortium wont sell to anyone without SMFC's best interests at heart

They dont want to but what if they need to sell. Never believed they would wait forever. It seems quite clear they are going to sell before new season. I fans do not take the opportunity now who knows who we will get but IMO it will be funded by loans placed in the clubs name.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

......until I read this post - you're the second CICer who's made this suggestion in the past couple of days.

I don't want to sell my shares!

unlike the Consortium & GLS I'm not looking for my money back.

.

BtB - I think LS was replying to my post where I asked if anyone wanted to buy my shares at market value. My post was made tongue in cheek as like you I havent thought of selling them

[billyg]

I'm not convinced either , and neither are some who I spoke to tonight most of whom I thought were certs to sign up. We'll see what the Herald says tomorrow , maybe Johnny Foreigner is the answer after all !