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4 hours ago, Dickson said:

I agree with this. 

My colleague at work is 67 years old. He said exactly the same thing last Wednesday. Isolate the over 60's and those with medical conditions and let everyone else carry on as normal. Absolutely the simplest solution. 

They are lots of people out there that have underlaying medical conditions that their unaware of. https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football/11182809/football-coach-dead-21-coronavirus/    Aren't  over 60's allowed to carry on as normal.   :unsure: 

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Like I said in my first post on this thread the current government will not choose the policy version that benefits "the many". 
I quite like a slogan and have no intention of stopping - the only faux leftie-ism in this discussion is yours , which I am sure you will drop when it suits C'apn!. 


Yeh, you like a slogan used by multi millionaires!

And your first paragraph is irrelevant!

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3 hours ago, Hiram Abiff said:

How realistic is that the tide can turn in 12 weeks like Boris says?

Looking at China, it took them about 3 weeks to get into the peak period of deaths, which lasted about a week and a half.

Of course, their lockdown was very drastic.


 

Well Boris thought Brexit was a great idea.  Bit of damage to the economy, leave one of world's 3 biggest trading blocs, geo-politics going crazy left, right and centre.  No problem.  I certainly trust everything he says and it's not completely about his massive ego at all. 😊

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Guest TPAFKATS
Well Boris thought Brexit was a great idea.  Bit of damage to the economy, leave one of world's 3 biggest trading blocs, geo-politics going crazy left, right and centre.  No problem.  I certainly trust everything he says and it's not completely about his massive ego at all. 
Funnily enough, 12 weeks is approximately when we would need to make a decision on extending brexit.

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31 minutes ago, Dickson said:

I've seen figures quote re South Korea's death rates.

0-29 years old was 0%

50+ was 0.37%

60+ was 1.51%

70+ was 5.35%

80+ was 10.4%

 

Similar stats are coming out of China and Italy. Italy I believe 87% of the deaths were over 70 years old. The US says 80% of their deaths are over 65. 

The number of young people who are dying from health conditions they didn't know about must be absolutely minuscule. It's obvious where the greater risk is. 

I showed my Mum these stats earlier today. She's 79 and went out for dinner with her pal yesterday. She promised to stay in today but she's been to Lidl and to the bank. Tomorrow she was planning a trip to the butchers. I showed her the stats and I showed her Andy's rant and I think the message finally hit home with her. He's absolutely right - we are putting everyones lives on hold primarily to protect the elderly and many of them are acting like they couldn't give a f**k! 

 

Good for her. That generation won't sit around waiting to be patronised and controlled by the likes of you.

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2 hours ago, oaksoft said:

Good for her. That generation won't sit around waiting to be patronised and controlled by the likes of you.

The industry I work in has been decimated. Jobs already lost all over the place. My work has cut 450k from the forecast until the end of April and were already seeing the lowest paid members of staff on the weakest contracts get cut or binned completely. 

99 per cent of the people in the industry would survive this virus, but places are closing to protect that generation and others who are not so well placed to deal with a new virus. But I'm glad you think it's good of them to do what the f**k they want. 

Plenty of small businesses will never open after this, some big ones too. But your right. Let the old f**kers go to the butcher while people are losing jobs because of recommendations not to go to pubs, restaurants etc. 

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2 hours ago, slapsalmon said:

The industry I work in has been decimated. Jobs already lost all over the place. My work has cut 450k from the forecast until the end of April and were already seeing the lowest paid members of staff on the weakest contracts get cut or binned completely. 

99 per cent of the people in the industry would survive this virus, but places are closing to protect that generation and others who are not so well placed to deal with a new virus. But I'm glad you think it's good of them to do what the f**k they want. 

Plenty of small businesses will never open after this, some big ones too. But your right. Let the old f**kers go to the butcher while people are losing jobs because of recommendations not to go to pubs, restaurants etc. 

When you calm down we can maybe talk again.

In the meantime I would suggest you do things.

1) Talk to either government and ask why they haven't announced a total lockdown. That is the sole reason people are still venturing outside.

2) Remind yourself that everyone is affected by this, not just you. I posted a couple of days ago that my own company has seen a 60% drop in income virtually overnight and I am living off 4-6 months of reserves. I don't have a nice wage to rely on. I certainly don't need lectures from you on this situation. Don't be so f**king presumptious and quit yer f**king whining.

Honestly, we are turning into a nation of spineless fuds cowering under the sheets over this thing.

Beginning to think Faraway was right. Grow a pair of balls FFS.

Edited by oaksoft

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3 hours ago, oaksoft said:

When you calm down we can maybe talk again.

In the meantime I would suggest you do things.

1) Talk to either government and ask why they haven't announced a total lockdown. That is the sole reason people are still venturing outside.

2) Remind yourself that everyone is affected by this, not just you. I posted a couple of days ago that my own company has seen a 60% drop in income virtually overnight and I am living off 4-6 months of reserves. I don't have a nice wage to rely on. I certainly don't need lectures from you on this situation. Don't be so f**king presumptious and quit yer f**king whining.

Honestly, we are turning into a nation of spineless fuds cowering under the sheets over this thing.

Beginning to think Faraway was right. Grow a pair of balls FFS.

Likewise... our charity has about five months of reserves.

We have also had to cancel all of our major fundraisers.

Shutting down until told it is safe to reopen was a no brainer.

I have a responsibility, not only to my service users and their carers... but to my staff and volunteers.

Staff are instructed to practice social distancing or, if high risk, self isolate.

They are also on full wage for as long as we can afford it.

We are going to need them coming out of this crisis.

As a wee aside... that also includes people on zero hours contracts! You know... the much maligned and abused employment practice!

I have two people on a zero hours contract.

Their studies and employment elsewhere means they are not flexible or able to accept a working contract.

i give them shifts regularly though.

For the next twelve weeks... even if not working... they are on average earnings!

They are part of my core team and deserve no less.

Just saying... zero hours contracts are often abused.... but not always a bad thing!

 

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This, as expected, is now hitting "us" and, as such, is becoming more real and emotive. (See a few posts above)

I spoke to a mate from Paisley last night, laid off as work has stopped, not reduced, stopped completely in the business he's in.

When things like this happen people's opinions and emotions change.

I'm aware my opinion has been that this has, somehow, been treated as something akin to the end of the world.

Not forgetting that every number is a person and that has an affect on family and friends.

When people lose their jobs this can have serious consequences and cause real worries.

The numbers, and we're well into this now worldwide, do not reflect the reaction by some IMO but have also been reduced by actions of some countries.

10,048 death worldwide.

I think, and is only my opinion, that overall this has been handled well by governments.

The British public have shown extreme reactions, both good and bad.

Plenty great stories of people helping other's along with the more obvious madness of panic buying.

One good thing, Ricky has reduced posting his usual drivel, surely we should rejoice? 

 

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9 hours ago, TPAFKATS said:
9 hours ago, David Mc said:
Well Boris thought Brexit was a great idea.  Bit of damage to the economy, leave one of world's 3 biggest trading blocs, geo-politics going crazy left, right and centre.  No problem.  I certainly trust everything he says and it's not completely about his massive ego at all. emoji4.png

Funnily enough, 12 weeks is approximately when we would need to make a decision on extending brexit.

FFS give it a rest. :thumbsdown

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Likewise... our charity has about five months of reserves.
We have also had to cancel all of our major fundraisers.
Shutting down until told it is safe to reopen was a no brainer.
I have a responsibility, not only to my service users and their carers... but to my staff and volunteers.
Staff are instructed to practice social distancing or, if high risk, self isolate.
They are also on full wage for as long as we can afford it.
We are going to need them coming out of this crisis.
As a wee aside... that also includes people on zero hours contracts! You know... the much maligned and abused employment practice!
I have two people on a zero hours contract.
Their studies and employment elsewhere means they are not flexible or able to accept a working contract.
i give them shifts regularly though.
For the next twelve weeks... even if not working... they are on average earnings!
They are part of my core team and deserve no less.
Just saying... zero hours contracts are often abused.... but not always a bad thing!
 


Well done, BiEK, that's exactly how zero hours contracts should be used.

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7 hours ago, slapsalmon said:

The industry I work in has been decimated. Jobs already lost all over the place. My work has cut 450k from the forecast until the end of April and were already seeing the lowest paid members of staff on the weakest contracts get cut or binned completely. 

99 per cent of the people in the industry would survive this virus, but places are closing to protect that generation and others who are not so well placed to deal with a new virus. But I'm glad you think it's good of them to do what the f**k they want. 

Plenty of small businesses will never open after this, some big ones too. But your right. Let the old f**kers go to the butcher while people are losing jobs because of recommendations not to go to pubs, restaurants etc. 

Your post (perhaps driven by govt messages and maladroit actions) has logical inconsistencies.  Your industry closing will not protect a generation.  Shutting down all of the country MAY delay the peak of infection, but won’t stop it spreading.

dickson’s figures underline that older people (it’s probably more precisely those with underlying conditions) are at risk.  We will all be exposed to it, sooner or later.  I’m not looking forward to it.  I worry for my friends and family, but it’s unavoidable.

A further huge factor in the likelihood of bad fatalities in the uk is that the NHS has been underfunded by mainly Tory govts for years.  Labour consistently shovelled funds in to support this jewel in the UK’s crown: tories “slimmed it down” and promoted Private Health alternatives, for the rich.  It is Tory mismanagement which puts us at greater risk.  They are trying to cover their venal arses too late.

If the govt was clear about closing pubs and restaurants (the wanker PM refuses to say they should close, cos he has been heavily financed by his pals in insurance!) then pubs could and would close.  But their insurance won’t let/help them out - they are being forced to stay open as they need as much help as they can get.

pubs are small businesses too!  I want them to be able to re-open after this.

 

fwiw, my Saturday bevvy bunch, All fit, all runners, all 40 - 80 yo, has just set up a WhatsApp group - just for the purpose of using pubs.

we normally just stagger in randomly to various pubs,  but the Blitz spirit is kicking in.

 

PS this government has announced this morning that it wants to encourage exNHS staff back in to help sort out THEIR shit.  To this end...  it is....  SENDING OUT LETTERS!

That’s urgency  for you.  :lol:

...not to mention the letter-passing of paper-borne covid 19, as folk earlier worried on this thread.  :)

...and especially not to mention the logical inconsistency that all those letters will be received by OLD RETIRED FOLK, - those people who are most likely to take infection rather badly!

It would almost make you think the Tories wanted to kill off a mob of old gits who are on good pensions.

shedding debt with dead people...

 

 

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11 hours ago, Dickson said:

I've seen figures quote re South Korea's death rates.

0-29 years old was 0%

50+ was 0.37%

60+ was 1.51%

70+ was 5.35%

80+ was 10.4%

 

Similar stats are coming out of China and Italy. Italy I believe 87% of the deaths were over 70 years old. The US says 80% of their deaths are over 65. 

The number of young people who are dying from health conditions they didn't know about must be absolutely minuscule. It's obvious where the greater risk is. 

I showed my Mum these stats earlier today. She's 79 and went out for dinner with her pal yesterday. She promised to stay in today but she's been to Lidl and to the bank. Tomorrow she was planning a trip to the butchers. I showed her the stats and I showed her Andy's rant and I think the message finally hit home with her. He's absolutely right - we are putting everyones lives on hold primarily to protect the elderly and many of them are acting like they couldn't give a f**k! 

 

No surprise there. They probably spent halve their life's in McDonald, KFC, Denny's  etc.   

 

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When you calm down we can maybe talk again. In the meantime I would suggest you do things.

1) Talk to either government and ask why they haven't announced a total lockdown. That is the sole reason people are still venturing outside.

2) Remind yourself that everyone is affected by this, not just you. I posted a couple of days ago that my own company has seen a 60% drop in income virtually overnight and I am living off 4-6 months of reserves. I don't have a nice wage to rely on. I certainly don't need lectures from you on this situation. Don't be so f**king presumptious and quit yer f**king whining.

Honestly, we are turning into a nation of spineless fuds cowering under the sheets over this thing.

Beginning to think Faraway was right. Grow a pair of balls FFS.

 

 

He’s right though

 

These people are losing their jobs to protect these old fcukers are who are still out socialising as if nothing is happening

 

The government has told them not to do it and why

 

But they’re ignoring the advice

 

 You’re the one always banging on about people needing to take personal responsibility

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16 minutes ago, Hiram Abiff said:

 

He’s right though

 

These people are losing their jobs to protect these old fcukers are who are still out socialising as if nothing is happening

 

The government has told them not to do it and why

 

But they’re ignoring the advice

 

 

I think we can safely ignore YOUR dribblings... :)

 

Salmonbuddie could be just as right by complaining about all those younger f**kers of his own age who WILL persist on going to gyms, “as if nothing is happening”!

This inept Tory government is not doing anything about that.  A government should be doing ALL in its power to do the best for all of the people, not just its paymasters.

Nor is the government doing anything about the panic-shopping and emptying of supermarket shelves by all ages of people, “as if nothing is happening!”.  Churning supermarkets packed with people and all queueing and coughing, side by side...

Divide and rule is an old Tory ploy.   Boris plays it well.  They want anyone but themselves to be seen as the Baddies.

Trivial slights against one particular section of society does nothing to cast light on the reality that we’re all in this together.

 

 

Edited by antrin

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Well done, BiEK, that's exactly how zero hours contracts should be used.
Cheers.
It would be so simple to put legislative protection into place for people who actually want a flexible contact like that.

I also make sure anyone on a zero hours contact gets a full seven hours per year pro-rata holiday pay. They earned it.

That should be enshrined in law.

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I think we can safely ignore YOUR dribblings... 
 
Salmonbuddie could be just as right by complaining about all those younger f**kers of his own age who WILL persist on going to gyms, “as if nothing is happening”!
This inept Tory government is not doing anything about that.  A government should be doing ALL in its power to do the best for all of the people, not just its paymasters.
Nor is the government doing anything about the panic-shopping and emptying of supermarket shelves by all ages of people, “as if nothing is happening!”.  Churning supermarkets packed with people and all queueing and coughing, side by side...
Divide and rule is an old Tory ploy.   Boris plays it well.  They want anyone but themselves to be seen as the Baddies.
Trivial slights against one particular section of society does nothing to cast light on the reality that we’re all in this together.
 
 


Except that my dribbling are right. As always.

The ONE particular section in society I’m talking about is vulnerable people who are out and about ignoring government advice.

If these people stay quarantined then it doesn’t matter if the young fcukers get it. It’s a mild illness for them. Better we build up herd immunity and get it all over with.

The destruction of the world economy will have serious consequences for the healthcare of the whole country going forward.

But hey, you continue with your right on leftie slogans. That’ll fix the problem.

As for salmonbuddie, he’s almost as big an arse as TPAFTWAT

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