Jump to content

faraway saint

Coronavirus

Recommended Posts

1 minute ago, bazil85 said:

Yes, yes I am. When it comes to human life, it isn't even a question for me. 

As for your last point, we are seeing worrying increasing trends despite heavy restrictions, there is no one in their right mind that can deny it's a concern. Do you genuinely not think that number will go up considerably under Oaksters BAU solution?

But hey, as long as you don't miss out on another summer holiday and can go to the boozer again, who cares? 🤷‍♂️

You sir, are a buffoon of the highest order and I pity your boss.

It must be a nightmare digging out simple repetitive jobs to keep you busy every day.

We're done. :byebye

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, faraway saint said:

You sir, are a buffoon of the highest order and I pity your boss.

It must be a nightmare digging out simple repetitive jobs to keep you busy every day.

We're done:byebye

I have again clearly upset you by having a different view and you again lash out.

You've also went back to the old, tired lie that you tell yourself often. Catch you back on here to continue the conversation soon. :whistle

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

We don't make decisions to kill big volumes of the vulnerable population at this point. We continue work on a possible vaccination and the younger, fitter people suck it up and accept life isn't going to be so normal for the foreseeable.

We take the economic hit and spend money in the best way we can to sustain and support our communities including those impacted with other conditions both physically and mentally. We continue with give and take measures such as some pain in the hospitality sector (with them being supported) so that we can take some reasonable normalised steps with schools, education, children etc. 

If it comes to it in a year/ two years or so that a vaccine isn't forthcoming, then we have conversations as a population on the long-term approach we want to take.

Jesus the first cases were barely recorded by Valentines day and you're wanting death warrants signed before Halloween! We have more time before we nuclear option a large chunk of people in the world. 😪

Two years of lockdown?

That is absolutely insane?

In your fantasy world, who pays the mortgages and bills of the millions who will be out of work by then?

Who puts food on their tables?

What taxes need to go up and by how much to pay for all of this?

What do we do with cancer patients and dying kids?

What about those needing organ transplants?

What about the 200 people per day dying of diabetes?

What about all those lives? All to be discarded because of 70 UK deaths a day due to covid?

When your grand plan is done you'll have well over 1 million young graduates turfed out onto a destroyed emplyment market.

You are insane and fortunately nowhere near a position of responsibility as regards covid.

Edited by oaksoft

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quite a drop in cases today, that'll upset Bazil.

Fatalities still very low, hospital cases still low...............................yet the economy is struggling, and the wave is coming, not cases or death, redundancies at the end of this month.

It's ok everybody, only a year or two or so of this, you'll all be fine. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, oaksoft said:

Two years of lockdown?

That is absolutely insane?

In your fantasy world, who pays the mortgages and bills of the millions who will be out of work by then?

Who puts food on their tables?

What taxes need to go up and by how much to pay for all of this?

What do we do with cancer patients and dying kids?

What about those needing organ transplants?

What about the 200 people per day dying of diabetes?

What about all those lives? All to be discarded because of 70 UK deaths a day due to covid?

When your grand plan is done you'll have well over 1 million young graduates turfed out onto a destroyed emplyment market.

You are insane and fortunately nowhere near a position of responsibility as regards covid.

We aren't in lockdown, we are in a situation where we can still have a number of freedoms and many people can continue working. 

There is more than enough resource and financial capability to support the people out of work. Decisions not to are political ones, as I have said before politics shouldn't steer choices on protecting lives. If my taxes or anyone elses taxes need to go up, so be it. Small price to pay to support the covid19 vulnerable groups. 

Regarding cancer patients how does your approach address them any easier? You want "all" restrictions lifted which means hospitals/ ICU units go nuts with people with Covid19. So how exactly under your solution do the cancer patients get the priority treatment they need? Is it more we don't only let a bunch of old people die, we let them die without any real medical care so we can treat other people? Oh, who by the way will have a far higher risk of getting it in the community under your (final) solution. 

I'm not sure what dying kids have to do with anything but with organ transplants, diabetes patients, etc the same logic above applies. In a world where we let things run, observably (earlier this year) one of the first thing that happens is hospitals fills up. Your solution sees a lot more short-term pain for the apparent long-term good. A long-term good that we could resolve in the next few months with a vaccine... Without killing many thousands more. 

I also don't think you're ignorant enough to think that number would still be 70 if we had lifted all restrictions when you first suggested it. 

Employment markets bounce back. Support people now, see what we can do regarding Covid19 without hitting the nuclear button on the vulnerable. 

The decisions made by the people in power are much, much, much closer to my view than your "anyone over the age of 70 or in poor health is expendable" one. You're not only insane, you're a sociopath. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, faraway saint said:

Quite a drop in cases today, that'll upset Bazil.

Fatalities still very low, hospital cases still low...............................yet the economy is struggling, and the wave is coming, not cases or death, redundancies at the end of this month.

It's ok everybody, only a year or two or so of this, you'll all be fine. 

As I predicted, your go to lie... You just can't keep away. :whistle

Also don't be so ridiculous. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

We aren't in lockdown, we are in a situation where we can still have a number of freedoms and many people can continue working. 

There is more than enough resource and financial capability to support the people out of work. Decisions not to are political ones, as I have said before politics shouldn't steer choices on protecting lives. If my taxes or anyone elses taxes need to go up, so be it. Small price to pay to support the covid19 vulnerable groups. 

Regarding cancer patients how does your approach address them any easier? You want "all" restrictions lifted which means hospitals/ ICU units go nuts with people with Covid19. So how exactly under your solution do the cancer patients get the priority treatment they need? Is it more we don't only let a bunch of old people die, we let them die without any real medical care so we can treat other people? Oh, who by the way will have a far higher risk of getting it in the community under your (final) solution. 

I'm not sure what dying kids have to do with anything but with organ transplants, diabetes patients, etc the same logic above applies. In a world where we let things run, observably (earlier this year) one of the first thing that happens is hospitals fills up. Your solution sees a lot more short-term pain for the apparent long-term good. A long-term good that we could resolve in the next few months with a vaccine... Without killing many thousands more. 

I also don't think you're ignorant enough to think that number would still be 70 if we had lifted all restrictions when you first suggested it. 

Employment markets bounce back. Support people now, see what we can do regarding Covid19 without hitting the nuclear button on the vulnerable. 

The decisions made by the people in power are much, much, much closer to my view than your "anyone over the age of 70 or in poor health is expendable" one. You're not only insane, you're a sociopath. 

 

I have realised that I can either discuss things with you, which is akin to talking to a brick wall, or I can allow you the oxygen of publicity, allow you to express your thoughts and let ohers decide whether retaining lockdown restrictions in the hope we find a vaccine in the next 2 years or so is a view worthy of supporting or worthy of derision.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, faraway saint said:

Quite a drop in cases today, that'll upset Bazil.

Fatalities still very low, hospital cases still low...............................yet the economy is struggling, and the wave is coming, not cases or death, redundancies at the end of this month.

It's ok everybody, only a year or two or so of this, you'll all be fine. 

It beggars belief that there are apparently functioning adults out there who think it is a reasonable approach to keep us all locked up for 2 or more years in the hope we find a vaccine to magically cure us all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, oaksoft said:

It beggars belief that there are apparently functioning adults out there who think it is a reasonable approach to keep us all locked up for 2 or more years in the hope we find a vaccine to magically cure us all.

But "he's" not in that bracket.

Let's both agree to try, as hard as it is to not point and laugh, to leave him out if this as it's a complete waste of time. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

I have realised that I can either discuss things with you, which is akin to talking to a brick wall, or I can allow you the oxygen of publicity, allow you to express your thoughts and let ohers decide whether retaining lockdown restrictions in the hope we find a vaccine in the next 2 years or so is a view worthy of supporting or worthy of derision.

People will ultimately have their own views. Just because I don't agree with you that we should write off the sick and vulnerable now, doesn't mean I don't think you're entitled to that opinion. 

I don't think it' unreasonable to restrict life longer in the hope of getting a vaccination. I would personally be fine waiting a year to two in order to develop a vaccination (in the hope it's much quicker) but I'm fully aware patience is waring thin with more and more people. It would ultimately get to a point in a world without a vaccine that we'd have to make difficult calls, making them at this stage is premature IMO.  

What I do think strange is you bringing up cancer & diabetes patience when your solution would observably cause them far more problems in getting treatment over the coming months and possibly years anyway. No one knows how fast Covid19 would run its course if we left its spread untreated. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

It beggars belief that there are apparently functioning adults out there who think it is a reasonable approach to keep us all locked up for 2 or more years in the hope we find a vaccine to magically cure us all.

That's your opinion, my opinion is it beggars belief there are function adults out there that think we are already at a timeframe where we should be stopping protecting the old and vulnerable to let life get back to normal (obviously not for them). Very impatient and self serving view. 

6 minutes ago, faraway saint said:

But "he's" not in that bracket.

Let's both agree to try, as hard as it is to not point and laugh, to leave him out if this as it's a complete waste of time. 

It shouldn't be this hard surely...  

Ultimately lets not forget though, both your issues with me right now is that I don't think we should centre our covid19 approach on the expendability of the elderly and vulnerable. Imagine thinking that view point is a "waste of time" or being a "drama queen" 🤷‍♂️

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites




So that would need tax increases of around 70% just to balance the books with regard to covid.



Only if you disregard job losses. It would really be a lot higher than 70%. If, say, 25% of the tax take was lost due to job losses, then add on the more benefits that would need to be paid to those newly unemployed (as I can't be arsed checking for the real numbers, I'll assume another 10% of the original tax take - though I may be well out there) that would mean a rise of about 46% just to balance the books on redundancies, then add on the covid debt, which would equate to about 100% of the 75% left of the original tax take and you end up with a rise of about 140-150%. That's obviously if you want to balance things as quickly as possible. They would, no doubt, spread it over many many years and pay lots of interest on it (increasing the bill) and have everyone paying it for the next 50-100 years or so. Of course, by that time, everyone will be used to higher taxes and they would just continue at that rate.

It's not even taking into account that the average wage (and hence tax take at the current rate) will probably fall due to it being an employer's market.

Obviously, they numbers are just a guesstimate (I hate that word but I know others will too, so I used it ) but I would assume a low of 100% to a high of 200%.

Or maybe I'm totally wrong. I'll wait for Baz to give his opinion so I know what the facts are.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites



The latest predictions from Imperial College.
I'm just drying out from last months prediction of 50,000 cases a day by October.
This shows areas that will become hotspots.......................although I'm ok as I'm not in any of these areas. 
GIFRUY Covid.
1bff4130-0a40-11eb-bf7d-d244db43c18c&key=f1e0cb83956068edd8e9683c9cd1b589c63e216c14e4ba64d38b38784d0062e8


Yes you are, Killin is included in the maps

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, bazil85 said:

We don't make decisions to kill big volumes of the vulnerable population at this point. We continue work on a possible vaccination and the younger, fitter people suck it up and accept life isn't going to be so normal for the foreseeable.

We take the economic hit and spend money in the best way we can to sustain and support our communities including those impacted with other conditions both physically and mentally. We continue with give and take measures such as some pain in the hospitality sector (with them being supported) so that we can take some reasonable normalised steps with schools, education, children etc. 

If it comes to it in a year/ two years or so that a vaccine isn't forthcoming, then we have conversations as a population on the long-term approach we want to take.

Jesus the first cases were barely recorded by Valentines day and you're wanting death warrants signed before Halloween! We have more time before we nuclear option a large chunk of people in the world. 😪

OK ill bite. So far there have already been 3.5 million people left with no income or support due to covid and job losses. It may be a political decision, and maybe it shouldn't be that way but the reality is, that's what's happening. 

"some pain" in hospitality. I'm guessing you don't work in hospitality. There's currently more than some pain in the industry and it's getting worse by the day. 

Any gains the industry has made in working conditions over the past years will be absolutely gone when any normality comes back as people will be absolutely desperate for work and will work for peanuts just to pay a gas bill. 

 

People are being shafted already and the peak of unemployment and businesses closing hasn't hit yet. The set back will take years to fix in a best case scenario

Edited by slapsalmon

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...