BuddieinEK Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 I think we need a bit of a reality check., here. When was the last time we won more than we lost? We're a small club, not destined to be among the top teams in Scotland. If we can at least challenge for a top six place and have the odd good cup run, then that's it, guys. Wake up. I personally think you are being unfair on the poster quoted. He's not advocating we challenge for second spot or regular European football... just stating that without some more consistency or winning runs... which just about every other team our level seem to do... we won't be challenging for top six. I love how this forum erupts into civil war after every defeat where even measured criticism is rounded upon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norrie82 Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 (edited) I think we need a bit of a reality check., here. When was the last time we won more than we lost? We're a small club, not destined to be among the top teams in Scotland. If we can at least challenge for a top six place and have the odd good cup run, then that's it, guys. Wake up. Tell Danny Lennon to stop saying we want top six then. In fact tell Inverness , Ross county, Motherwell, st.johnstone to all chuck it your small clubs with small fan bases so you shouldn't be in the top six!!! Each of these teams have made the top six. Do they have bigger supports? I think that currently the team has stalled and the current management need to use January to wheel and deal and if not then we won't do much. If we don't do much will the board keep the same manager? In fact it could be they don't sanction players coming anyhow! Regardless of this we need to move up we need to be ambitious and not settle for being a wee team from Paisley who should be happy just to survive Edited January 2, 2014 by norrie82 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddieinEK Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Tell Danny Lennon to stop saying we want top six then. In fact tell Inverness , Ross county, Motherwell, st.johnstone to all chuck it your small clubs with small fan bases so you shouldn't be in the top six!!! Your talking bullshit mate we can be as good as these teams we can do it but not with the current squad or management And after me defending you Norrie you go and make me disagree!!! I happen to believe that the current squad is good enough to be challenging for a top six finish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norrie82 Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 And after me defending you Norrie you go and make me disagree!!! I happen to believe that the current squad is good enough to be challenging for a top six finish. Buddie I changed my post. You know what I was wrong there I think like you we do have good players we have thommo, McGowan, McLean, McGinn , Kello, etc and they can do better. Maybe it's the way they're being set up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint in exile Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 I personally think you are being unfair on the poster quoted. He's not advocating we challenge for second spot or regular European football... just stating that without some more consistency or winning runs... which just about every other team our level seem to do... we won't be challenging for top six. I love how this forum erupts into civil war after every defeat where even measured criticism is rounded upon. I wasn't having a dig at the poster, but I do think we have a large percentage of fans whose expectations over the season are too high. We might get into the top six at times, but staying there is another matter. As I asked, when was the last season we won more than we lost? In all of our seasons in the SPL, how many times have we finished in the top six? That's not Lennon's fault, as some would like to believe. Consistency has been a problem at SMFC for most of the last 30 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islaysaint Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Have been at our last 3 away games, and each time we have been very poor. Today we soooooo missed Jim Goodwin and when John McGinn went off we had no dig at all in the middle. I was disgusted with the lack of contribution of Gary Harkins, ok he was only on for a short spell, but his lack of effort was pathetic. The big plus was the introduction of Adam Campbell, just a pity some of our other players didn't seem to have the same appetite. Thought best player on show was Craig Samson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint in exile Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Why is that it? Dunfermline were an established SPL club and are now skint and below us. Hearts are fcuked and below us. The Rangers are fcuked and are below us. Falkirk and Hamilton quietly slipped away while we retained SPL status and won a cup. For a good while under Paw Broon and Fenlon, we looked better than both Aberdeen and Hibs. Our current squad looks better than Ross County, Partick, Kilmarnock and doesn't look too shabby when compared to St Johnstone's. Point being - yes we are a small club, but are in a better place than many. I see no reason why we shouldn't be a club that can mix it with the likes of Motherwell and Dundee United aiming for the 'best of the rest', rather than accepting 'our fate' of being perennial relegation dogfighters 'lucky to be here' and displaying an attitude that we can never aspire to, or reach, a higher level. Looks like McInnes and Butcher are stamping their mark on previously poor sides, maybe this is where our problem lies. Butcher and McInnes are playing with budgets that we can never match. Dunfermline, Dundee and Hearts collapsed because they spent money they never had to keep up, and we know what happened at Ipox. Should we do the same? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddieinEK Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 I wasn't having a dig at the poster, but I do think we have a large percentage of fans whose expectations over the season are too high. We might get into the top six at times, but staying there is another matter. As I asked, when was the last season we won more than we lost? In all of our seasons in the SPL, how many times have we finished in the top six? That's not Lennon's fault, as some would like to believe. Consistency has been a problem at SMFC for most of the last 30 years. It would be all too easy to hark back to the halcyon days when we were were regularly in the mix at the top end; in cup semi finals; and in Europe... and maybe for old farts like me that is still in the back of the mind. Especially moreso given that Killie were rotting in division two at the time and Hearts were the perennial yo-yo club between spl and first division. However... to do so would also be to look at Dumbarton, Clydebank et al as top clubs! Pozbaird summed it up well and in a much more recent context for me... Falkirk; Hamilton; Dunfermline; The Rangers... all clubs that have fallen out of the SPL/SPFL in our time as a top flight club. "We might get into the top six at times" you say... well if you agree with that then why criticise fans for having aspirations? ICT; Ross County; St Johnstone; Motherwell... ... we are not a smaller or less successful club than any of these... so why can we match their poor runs... but never seem to go on the same kind of positive runs as them? Is it wrong to ask? To challenge ourselves? To want better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddieinEK Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Butcher and McInnes are playing with budgets that we can never match. Dunfermline, Dundee and Hearts collapsed because they spent money they never had to keep up, and we know what happened at Ipox. Should we do the same? Ross County? ICT? Motherwell? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isabella Duke Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Butcher and McInnes are playing with budgets that we can never match. Dunfermline, Dundee and Hearts collapsed because they spent money they never had to keep up, and we know what happened at Ipox. Should we do the same? The same as Inverness, St. Johnstone & Motherwell? Danny Lennon has had a budget that Butcher could never match while he was at Inverness! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddieinEK Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 "It is better to shoot for the stars and miss than aim at the gutter and hit it." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Why is that it? Dunfermline were an established SPL club and are now skint and below us. Hearts are fcuked and below us. The Rangers are fcuked and are below us. Falkirk and Hamilton quietly slipped away while we retained SPL status and won a cup. For a good while under Paw Broon and Fenlon, we looked better than both Aberdeen and Hibs. Our current squad looks better than Ross County, Partick, Kilmarnock and doesn't look too shabby when compared to St Johnstone's. Point being - yes we are a small club, but are in a better place than many. I see no reason why we shouldn't be a club that can mix it with the likes of Motherwell and Dundee United aiming for the 'best of the rest', rather than accepting 'our fate' of being perennial relegation dogfighters 'lucky to be here' and displaying an attitude that we can never aspire to, or reach, a higher level. Looks like McInnes and Butcher are stamping their mark on previously poor sides, maybe this is where our problem lies. Last season Adams was also in this elite list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isabella Duke Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 When Lennon arrived we had just finished 10th in the league (our highest finish after 2 decades). All the hard work had been done for him. We'd been pulled out of years of struggling in the First Division. We were established in the SPL and going into our 5th season in the top flight. We had no debt, money in the bank, a brand new stadium and brand new top class training facilities. Nearly 4 years on and we now sit 9th. And taking account of the fact that most teams in the SPL have moved up 2 places as a result of the meltdown of Rangers & Hearts, it means we have actually gone backwards! Lennon's time is up. Lennon and Craig should be shown the door as soon as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizard King Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Point being - yes we are a small club, but are in a better place than many. I see no reason why we shouldn't be a club that can mix it with the likes of Motherwell and Dundee United aiming for the 'best of the rest', rather than accepting 'our fate' of being perennial relegation dogfighters 'lucky to be here' and displaying an attitude that we can never aspire to, or reach, a higher level. Looks like McInnes and Butcher are stamping their mark on previously poor sides, maybe this is where our problem lies. Spot on that man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isabella Duke Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Last season Adams was also in this elite list. He still is. He's done a magnificent job getting Ross County into the SPL, finishing above us last season and close by this season - all on a much lower budget. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibbles old paperboy Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 When Lennon arrived we had just finished 10th in the league (our highest finish after 2 decades). All the hard work had been done for him. We'd been pulled out of years of struggling in the First Division. We were established in the SPL and going into our 5th season in the top flight. We had no debt, money in the bank, a brand new stadium and brand new top class training facilities. Nearly 4 years on and we now sit 9th. And taking account of the fact that most teams in the SPL have moved up 2 places as a result of the meltdown of Rangers & Hearts, it means we have actually gone backwards! Lennon's time is up. Lennon and Craig should be shown the door as soon as possible. If you'd posted this at any time in the previous month (when we were 8th) Danny would be equalling Gus' best SPL finish! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 He still is. He's done a magnificent job getting Ross County into the SPL, finishing above us last season and close by this season - all on a much lower budget. Get back to me later in the season, or don't you like quoting that it's only that Hearst have been deducted points that stopping his "great" team being bottom of the league? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrshire Saints Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 When Lennon arrived we had just finished 10th in the league (our highest finish after 2 decades). All the hard work had been done for him. We'd been pulled out of years of struggling in the First Division. We were established in the SPL and going into our 5th season in the top flight. We had no debt, money in the bank, a brand new stadium and brand new top class training facilities. Nearly 4 years on and we now sit 9th. And taking account of the fact that most teams in the SPL have moved up 2 places as a result of the meltdown of Rangers & Hearts, it means we have actually gone backwards! Lennon's time is up. Lennon and Craig should be shown the door as soon as possible. If nothing else you posts possess the consistency we strive for !!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibbles old paperboy Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Complaints about the lack of quality options from today's bench should surely be balanced by the fact Goodwin (suspension), McLean (injured), and Teale (injured) could normally be expected to be either in the starting XI or first team squad. Killie's winning run will not last much longer, we'll soon overtake them again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddieinEK Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Complaints about the lack of quality options from today's bench should surely be balanced by the fact Goodwin (suspension), McLean (injured), and Teale (injured) could normally be expected to be either in the starting XI or first team squad. Killie's winning run will not last much longer, we'll soon overtake them again. can you please explain this strange concept to a poor St Mirren fan! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidg Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 can you please explain this strange concept to a poor St Mirren fan! They're not even on a 'winning run'. They lost last week away at Hibs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddieinEK Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 They're not even on a 'winning run'. They lost last week away at Hibs. which is why they only have 9 points out of 12 instead of 12 points out of 12... ... I wish we could go on a non-run like that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibbles old paperboy Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 14 games left and 42 points to play for before the split happens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidg Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 which is why they only have 9 points out of 12 instead of 12 points out of 12... ... I wish we could go on a non-run like that! We've already been there..... 12 out of 15 starting at Tynecastle..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norrie82 Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Have been at our last 3 away games, and each time we have been very poor. Today we soooooo missed Jim Goodwin and when John McGinn went off we had no dig at all in the middle. I was disgusted with the lack of contribution of Gary Harkins, ok he was only on for a short spell, but his lack of effort was pathetic. The big plus was the introduction of Adam Campbell, just a pity some of our other players didn't seem to have the same appetite. Thought best player on show was Craig Samson Who has been brilliant both games we have played them. Danny though it was best to give him a shitty one year extension after all he done for us then go with two untried young goalies. Danny hasn't got it he probably wouldn't be there if it wasn't for the cup. How long can we live in the past though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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