oaksoft Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 1 hour ago, tony soprano said: It's entirely true. The Tories weren't the UK government until they won a majority in 2015. FS Tony. See above. Third time's the charm eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 5 hours ago, saintnextlifetime said: independent ɪndɪˈpɛnd(ə)nt/ adjective adjective: independent 1. free from outside control; not subject to another's authority. "an independent nuclear deterrent" synonyms: freethinking, individualistic, unconventional, maverick; More free, liberated, bold, free-spirited, unconstrained, unrestrained, unfettered, untrammelled, unhampered; undisciplined, wild, wilful, headstrong, contrary "entrepreneurs are independent spirits" antonyms: constrained, orthodox (of a country) self-governing. "India became independent in 1947" synonyms: self-governing, self-legislating, self-determining, sovereign, autonomous, autonomic, autarkic, free, non-aligned "an independent country" antonyms: dependent, subservient not belonging to or supported by a political party. "the independent candidate" (of broadcasting, a school, etc.) not supported by public funds. "an independent girls' school" synonyms: private, public, non-state-controlled, non-state-run, non-public, private-sector, private-enterprise, fee-paying, commercial; More privatized, denationalized "an independent school" antonyms: private, state-run historical Congregational. adjective: Independent 2. not depending on another for livelihood or subsistence. "I wanted to remain independent in old age" synonyms: self-sufficient, self-supporting, self-sustaining, self-reliant, self-standing, able to stand on one's own two feet; More self-contained, self-made; informalliving on one's hump "one has to be very careful about offering money to proud and independent old folk" antonyms: dependent (of income or resources) making it unnecessary to earn one's living. "a woman of independent means" 3. capable of thinking or acting for oneself. "advice for independent travellers" not influenced by others; impartial. "a thorough and independent investigation of the case" synonyms: impartial, unbiased, unprejudiced, neutral, disinterested, uninvolved, uncommitted, detached, dispassionate, objective, open-minded, equitable, non-partisan, even-handed, fair, fair-minded, just; More without favouritism, free from discrimination, non-discriminatory, with no axe to grind, without fear or favour; informalon the fence "an independent financial adviser" antonyms: biased, tied 4. not connected with another or with each other; separate. "treating each factory as an independent unit of production" synonyms: unconnected, unrelated, unassociated, dissociated, unattached, separate "the auditing of a company's accounts is done by independent accountants" antonyms: connected not depending on something else for strength or effectiveness; free-standing. "an independent electric shower" synonyms: separate, discrete, different, distinct, free-standing, self-contained, complete "the Institute will quickly become a fully independent unit" antonyms: subordinate Mathematics (of one of a set of axioms, equations, or quantities) incapable of being expressed in terms of, or derived or deduced from, the others. noun noun: independent; plural noun: independents 1. an independent person or body. "one of the few independents left in the music business" So , independence in Europe is not INDEPENDENCE , it would be a travesty . . Why can't we go back to the position they put us in 2 years ago , when they said we would not get into Europe . . By those definitions there is no such thing as an independent country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 5 hours ago, stlucifer said: Just like his triumphant, insulting quote because he managed to prove one, relatively insignificant detail in another's post Ach Dicko can be as triumphalistic as he likes on any subject. It won't make him important, and it won't make him happy. He can fill his boots as far as I am concerned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud the Baker Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 (edited) On 29/06/2016 at 11:35 AM, Stuart Dickson said: Huh? You're the one claiming anyone voting leave has boosted the right wing in UK politics. I'm the one pointing out that nothing has changed even if Natsis everywhere are trying desperately to make political capital out of trying to spread hysteria. When you run out of arguments you resort to name calling - it's a generally accepted rule that accusing someone of being a Nazi is a sign you've lost the argument. It was deemed unacceptable language by Ruth Davidson the leader of the party you claim to support and unhelpful by people whose relatives suffered at the hands of the real Nazis. It also exposes your hypocrisy on any issue involving respecting other people - you have no respect for anyone and I, for one, have no respect for you. ********************* My "hysterical" view of UK politics is one that is held by many people outside the SNP including as I pointed out earlier in the thread by Gordon Brown the guy who turned the tide at the last IndyRef. There will be a second IndyRef and people will have to make a choice - the big question is whether people like Gordon Brown will vote with their head or heart. Edited July 2, 2016 by Bud the Baker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddieinEK Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 "We are the half million English, Welsh and Irish" (from whom we want a divorce as they are obviously less important than the Latvians)! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antrin Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 2 hours ago, oaksoft said: By those definitions there is no such thing as an independent country. So why do you keep waffling on about it, if it's as tangible and realisable a concept as a Supreme Being? snlt is making a sound point. independence may well be a good and necessary goal for Scots, and perhaps not without pain, but it should be an independence worth suffering for - not just a different vassalage.... such as it would be under the jackboot of the EU that screwed Greece, Portugal, Spain and Eire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 1 hour ago, antrin said: So why do you keep waffling on about it, if it's as tangible and realisable a concept as a Supreme Being? snlt is making a sound point. independence may well be a good and necessary goal for Scots, and perhaps not without pain, but it should be an independence worth suffering for - not just a different vassalage.... such as it would be under the jackboot of the EU that screwed Greece, Portugal, Spain and Eire. Jackboot FFS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antrin Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 21 minutes ago, oaksoft said: Jackboot FFS f**kin idiot. what would you prefer? ballet pump? Sandal? Thong? at least you're honest about your twattery being real Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salmonbuddie Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 So why do you keep waffling on about it, if it's as tangible and realisable a concept as a Supreme Being? snlt is making a sound point. independence may well be a good and necessary goal for Scots, and perhaps not without pain, but it should be an independence worth suffering for - not just a different vassalage.... such as it would be under the jackboot of the EU that screwed Greece, Portugal, Spain and Eire. So let's take this opportunity to become independent of Westminster. Then, and only then, we can address whether or not we want to be independent of the EU. If you truly want independence from both then we do the first option then the second. Staying in the UK means we're there for the rest of our lifetimes, an indy Scotland in the EU can always vote to leave at a later date. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintnextlifetime Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 4 hours ago, antrin said: So why do you keep waffling on about it, if it's as tangible and realisable a concept as a Supreme Being? snlt is making a sound point. independence may well be a good and necessary goal for Scots, and perhaps not without pain, but it should be an independence worth suffering for - not just a different vassalage.... such as it would be under the jackboot of the EU that screwed Greece, Portugal, Spain and Eire. . .and the Cypriots , don't forget them , they got f**ked over too. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 2 hours ago, antrin said: f**kin idiot. what would you prefer? ballet pump? Sandal? Thong? I would prefer you to have the courage to stick to one tedious alias but we cant always get what we want. Have we leanred nothing from the Spice Girls? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stlucifer Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 2 minutes ago, oaksoft said: I would prefer you to have the courage to stick to one tedious alias but we cant always get what we want. Have we leanred nothing from the Spice Girls? Yep. If you wanna be stus's lover you gottta get with his friends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antrin Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 1 hour ago, oaksoft said: I would prefer you to have the courage to stick to one tedious alias but we cant always get what we want. Have we leanred nothing from the Spice Girls? It was The Stones. You've leanred nothing from The Spice Girls, despite being a big one... oaksoft is no less tedious an alias than antrin. What's your problem, other than twattery? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 (edited) 2 hours ago, salmonbuddie said: So let's take this opportunity to become independent of Westminster. Then, and only then, we can address whether or not we want to be independent of the EU. If you truly want independence from both then we do the first option then the second. Staying in the UK means we're there for the rest of our lifetimes, an indy Scotland in the EU can always vote to leave at a later date. So Indy Ref 2 quickly becomes Indy Ref 3. You Natsis don't half like your divisive referendums don't you? Well I suppose it keeps the Scottish peoples eyes off all of the failings of the SNP government. Edited July 2, 2016 by Stuart Dickson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 1 hour ago, stlucifer said: Yep. If you wanna be stus's lover you gottta get with his friends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 50 minutes ago, antrin said: It was The Stones. You've leanred nothing from The Spice Girls, despite being a big one... oaksoft is no less tedious an alias than antrin. What's your problem, other than twattery? Are you just grumpy because you are missing Dec? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy boo Posted July 2, 2016 Report Share Posted July 2, 2016 So let's take this opportunity to become independent of Westminster. Then, and only then, we can address whether or not we want to be independent of the EU. If you truly want independence from both then we do the first option then the second. Staying in the UK means we're there for the rest of our lifetimes, an indy Scotland in the EU can always vote to leave at a later date. Deluded... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted July 3, 2016 Report Share Posted July 3, 2016 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stlucifer Posted July 3, 2016 Report Share Posted July 3, 2016 7 hours ago, jimmy boo said: Deluded... I honestly can't see what's deluded in SB's point of view. You may not agree but the statement is plausible. IF we vote for an independent Scotland a newly elected Scottish Government, (Tory? Labour? Feck! Even Lib Dem{Perhaps that's deluded} ), could, feasibly, with the will of the Scottish people, decide to leave the EU. As for remain? Well, its become clear that its not clear on any side. Unprecedented. Therefore? Unknown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nosferatu Posted July 3, 2016 Report Share Posted July 3, 2016 The Euro? Premium Bonds? what a pair of fat simpletons! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickMcD Posted July 3, 2016 Report Share Posted July 3, 2016 Premium bonds could turn out to be a better investment than the euro. That's an interesting bet George Soros has got on about a German bank going bust. The EU is on the road to No Town as is the euro. Do some serious reading and listen to respected City commentators both in the UK and abroad. The consensus used to be about five years but that was before Brexit. Do you think the kerfuffle last week was solely because of Brexit? The implications for Europe will be horrendous. The SNP can't see it but then they believed oil was enough to keep Scotland going ad infinitum come hell or high water. And hell came. Every European country should be making plans for the Armageddon that will inevitably come to Europe. The lovely Angela will be in denial of course and they will probably cobble together a smaller EU Mark 2, but it will only fool the naïve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salmonbuddie Posted July 3, 2016 Report Share Posted July 3, 2016 11 hours ago, jimmy boo said: Deluded... What's delusional about it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud the Baker Posted July 3, 2016 Report Share Posted July 3, 2016 All the old certainties are undone....... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-36698036 Quote A possible second Scottish independence referendum should not be blocked by the UK government, Scottish Conservative leader Ruth Davidson has said. Quote Meanwhile, former Labour first minister Henry McLeish has said he could back independence, but that Scotland is "not ready". Mr McLeish told Sunday Politics Scotland "I've said the European issue has strengthened, positively, the case of independence and that I could vote for independence. "I was devastated last week when we took that catastrophic decision to leave the EU, I think that was a tipping point." He added: "But let me also put a shot across the bows of the SNP - we are not ready for independence, even if that was a reality. It really is just a matter of whether we have the confidence in ourselves or not.............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted July 3, 2016 Report Share Posted July 3, 2016 (edited) 3 hours ago, Bud the Baker said: All the old certainties are undone....... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-36698036 It really is just a matter of whether we have the confidence in ourselves or not.............. Its not just confidence. Its our entire cultural attitude which is problemmatic. I have spoken about the Scottish Disease before. Independence will be painful because of it make no bones about it, Edited July 3, 2016 by oaksoft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted July 5, 2016 Report Share Posted July 5, 2016 (edited) I see the experts at the Centre for Policy Studies have given their view on Scottish Independence. "Greece without the sun" is the direct quote. They went on to say that Scotlands budget deficit at present is 300% higher than the rest of the UK in terms of GDP. Quote “North Sea oil and gas revenue expectations have plunged. Expected revenues of £6.8 billion to £7.9 billion this year have fallen to just £0.5 billion to £2.8 billion. “Two-thirds of Scotland’s exports go to the rest of the UK but just 15 per cent go to other EU countries, further questioning the economic rationale behind Scottish independence. “Euro membership would expose Scotland to the risk of more asymmetric economic shocks and the European Central Bank would be less capable of responding to shocks compared to the Bank of England.” It concluded: “Why, therefore, would you break ties with the UK for the purpose of restoring ties with the rest of the EU via European Union membership? “Furthermore, if Scotland were proposing to adopt the euro as its currency, this would present huge risks for a newly-independent Scotland. “There is a precedent for a small, romantic country, surrounded by hundreds of islands, perched on the extremity of Europe, seeking membership of the euro: Greece. “Of course, it would be impertinent to suggest that Scotland’s circumstances are directly equivalent to those of Greece, but it does undoubtedly serve as a useful reminder that countries with challenging public finances can end up suffering inside the euro. “This will undoubtedly be on the minds of the Scottish electorate should there be a second independence referendum.” Now I look forward to seeing Slarti and Oaksoft counter their expert analysis with tales of Nationalist Grannies buying new Scottish Groat Premium Bonds will help keep the country afloat and telling us all that on extremely windy days in Scotland we'll be able to raise enough money to give a handful of our pensioners their state pension if the South East of England will only buy our spare electricity from us instead of either generating their own, or getting it from their near neighbour in France. Edited July 5, 2016 by Stuart Dickson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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