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Lord Pityme

Sign Shankland!

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5 hours ago, Lord Pityme said:

We need goals - He scoring for fun

We need a focus point up front - he bursts through defences, makes it eadier for midfield to link up, great target for an out.

We need someone who is lean and hungry - he looks well toned, and strong

We need someone with the above capabilities, in our budget - this he is, with only avyear left on his current contract

get on it Tony & Stubbzo, buy the guy who scores!

 

 

Do you know what else we need, threads like this to have been entered correctly in the speculation thread.

 

Keep our forum tidy, keep it tidy indeed.

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9 minutes ago, Soctty said:

So when you said you did have proof, what you meant was you didn't... :lol: 

You mean apart from the proof I shared with you? :rolleyes:

You can be as pedantic as you want, it doesn't change facts. A club being in the Championship for an extra season is worth more than them getting relegated and being in League 1. Or perhaps you genuinely disagree? That would be very worrying... 

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I play walking football run by Ayr Utd. & the inside word is that LS hired a personal fitness instructor and shed over a stone from his last season with us/Morton - congrats to the guy who  could've been just another washed  up "contender" at 22 but now he's earned himself another chance.

Probably the hot ticket right now & thus out of our price range but after spending big on Talent Show hopefools (sic) who knows? 

Edited by Bud the Baker

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3 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

You mean apart from the proof I shared with you? :rolleyes:

You can be as pedantic as you want, it doesn't change facts. A club being in the Championship for an extra season is worth more than them getting relegated and being in League 1. Or perhaps you genuinely disagree? That would be very worrying... 

You gave no proof at all. You bumping your gums about season tickets and TV money is not proof of anything, other than that you don't know what proof is...

It's not pedantic to want you to back up your words with some sort of proof. You either have proof or you don't. 

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As a side note; this new found love for berating Danny Mullen is laughable. Easy to forget he is only 23 and is adjusting to this level as much as any other player (although so far in Pre-Season he has either been isolated or played completely out of position!)

He is a significant upgrade on Gavin Reilly and without his footballing intelligence, tenacity and work rate in the last 6 months of the season i’m not sure we’d have won the league as comfortably as we did, however, a 15-20 goals a season striker he is not - this is Stubbs’ problem to address. Find a suitable prolific partner for Danny and play to both their strengths.

...with all that said I have no doubt the posters posting such nonsense are at the wind up to suit their agenda.

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8 minutes ago, Soctty said:

You gave no proof at all. You bumping your gums about season tickets and TV money is not proof of anything, other than that you don't know what proof is...

It's not pedantic to want you to back up your words with some sort of proof. You either have proof or you don't. 

So you think a season in the Scottish Championship would be worth less than £100k for a team like Ayr to a year in League 1?

You're clearly being pedantic. The figures behind all the points I made are the proof (Prize money, crowds, season ticket income). To want me to go and list it all on here when you clearly know the figures will be more than £100k... pedantic. 

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Just now, bazil85 said:

So you think a season in the Scottish Championship would be worth less than £100k for a team like Ayr to a year in League 1?

You're clearly being pedantic. The figures behind all the points I made are the proof (Prize money, crowds, season ticket income). To want me to go and list it all on here when you clearly know the figures will be more than £100k... pedantic. 

I'm in no way being pedantic. What was Ayr's turnover the last time they were in the Championship? What was it last year? What's the difference? We can look for facts (being pedantic) or we can just work on what's inside your head (mostly sawdust)...

"The points I made are proof" - no, they're not.

If you can't prove it, just say "I'm totally guessing".

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11 minutes ago, W6Saint said:

As a side note; this new found love for berating Danny Mullen is laughable. Easy to forget he is only 23 and is adjusting to this level as much as any other player (although so far in Pre-Season he has either been isolated or played completely out of position!)

He is a significant upgrade on Gavin Reilly and without his footballing intelligence, tenacity and work rate in the last 6 months of the season i’m not sure we’d have won the league as comfortably as we did, however, a 15-20 goals a season striker he is not - this is Stubbs’ problem to address. Find a suitable prolific partner for Danny and play to both their strengths.

...with all that said I have no doubt the posters posting such nonsense are at the wind up to suit their agenda.

I've thought he was one of our better players in most of the matches we've played so far. Tired badly after halftime against Sunderland (who knew players would be struggling for fitness in preseason), but was one of few who looked effective in the first half. Works incredibly hard, is strong on the ball and I'm sure will net a few for us next season. As you say, still young and developing.

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9 minutes ago, Soctty said:

I'm in no way being pedantic. What was Ayr's turnover the last time they were in the Championship? What was it last year? What's the difference? We can look for facts (being pedantic) or we can just work on what's inside your head (mostly sawdust)...

"The points I made are proof" - no, they're not.

If you can't prove it, just say "I'm totally guessing".

Right, well since I'm a bit bored, I got the evidence you sorely want, to prove a point that even a child should know as fact. I've only looked at two points because let's be honest that's enough. 

Prize money: for 8th in Championship £190k, Prize money even if they bounce back up in 1st in L1 £119k. (£71k ) 

Crowds: Average attendance last season for Ayr 1,533. Year before in Championship 1,866 so 333 extra fans average over 18 games. Now that will be a mix of adults, Student's OAP, children and season tickets (imagine you don't want proof of that? :rolleyes:). Ever if we assumed they were all paying the OAP/ Student/ 18-21 ticket price of  £10. That's still £59,940

For two factors, Championship football over the last one season in each league (when taking a cautious approach to ticket prices) was worth £130,940

But yet their top goalscorer last season, a player that looks on absolute fire, briming with confidence, a key player... £50k and Danny Mullan who's scared of nets :lol:

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But yet their top goalscorer last season, a player that looks on absolute fire, briming with confidence, a key player... £50k and Danny Mullan who's scared of nets default_laugh.png

 

Ah yes, let’s spend £50K + our best striker currently, on a player who is a mid table Championship player at best and is scared of staying fit.

Even £50K is too much for Shankland, laughable to even consider paying that much never mind the mentioned £300K! (Btw, where do people think we’re pulling that sort of money from. If we had that sitting around we’d not be in the position we’re in and we’d have the Adam Rooney’s of this world up front and definitely not be trialling players from the Racecourse against Sunderland)

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Shankland has no pace and doesn’t really get involved in games unless he’s getting provided properly, a bit like a Kris Boyd type hence why Jack Ross got rid of him as he wasn’t his cup of tea. He’s having a great time at the minute but I’m not sure he’d be as effective at the top level unless we had a bunch of creative midfielders teeing him up which we obviously don’t so I feel he would be a passenger in a team like ours at the minute

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3 minutes ago, W6Saint said:

 

Ah yes, let’s spend £50K + our best striker currently, on a player who is a mid table Championship player at best and is scared of staying fit.

Even £50K is too much for Shankland, laughable to even consider paying that much never mind the mentioned £300K! (Btw, where do people think we’re pulling that sort of money from. If we had that sitting around we’d not be in the position we’re in and we’d have the Adam Rooney’s of this world up front and definitely not be trialling players from the Racecourse against Sunderland)

Yep, I don't think for a second we should be entertaining Shankland because it simply won't happen. they won't want to sell, he won't want to come to St Mirren and we can't afford what they'd want for him. There's a difference between a players value and a selling price. They'd want way over his woth and there's no gurantee he could do it in the SP. 

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29 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

Right, well since I'm a bit bored, I got the evidence you sorely want, to prove a point that even a child should know as fact. I've only looked at two points because let's be honest that's enough. 

Prize money: for 8th in Championship £190k, Prize money even if they bounce back up in 1st in L1 £119k. (£71k ) 

Crowds: Average attendance last season for Ayr 1,533. Year before in Championship 1,866 so 333 extra fans average over 18 games. Now that will be a mix of adults, Student's OAP, children and season tickets (imagine you don't want proof of that? :rolleyes:). Ever if we assumed they were all paying the OAP/ Student/ 18-21 ticket price of  £10. That's still £59,940

For two factors, Championship football over the last one season in each league (when taking a cautious approach to ticket prices) was worth £130,940

But yet their top goalscorer last season, a player that looks on absolute fire, briming with confidence, a key player... £50k and Danny Mullan who's scared of nets :lol:

Prize money for 8th - £190k, Prize money for 10th - £166k. Difference £24k. Add the £60k and you get a grand total of £84K. Policing and stewarding costs would increase, plus other overheads which would reduce that. Probably talking about around £100k total benefit I'd imagine taking into account reduced cost season tickets and the average of pay at the gate punters.

This all assumes that losing Shankland would guarantee they'd be relegated - you'd think with £100k in the kitty they'd be able to strengthen several areas, including up front. (I've never suggested £50k plus Mullen)

ETA Do you know any children who know the financials of lower league clubs in Scotland? Really?

Edited by Soctty

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1 minute ago, Soctty said:

Prize money for 8th - £190k, Prize money for 10th - £166k. Difference £24k. Add the £60k and you get a grand total of £84K. Policing and stewarding costs would increase, plus other overheads which would reduce that. Probably talking about around £100k total benefit I'd imagine taking into account reduced cost season tickets and the average of pay at the gate punters.

This all assumes that losing Shankland would guarantee they'd be relegated - you'd think with £100k in the kitty they'd be able to strengthen several areas, including up front. (I've never suggested £50k plus Mullen)

Again, I know you struggle. My point is that keeping them in the Championship for an extra season is worth more. How do you propose they get Championship 8th/ 10th place prize money by playing in League 1? :blink:

So taking that into account, back to £130,900. Policing, Stewarding costs I wouldn't imagine are an extra £30k for 300 fans, although feel free to evidence if you disagree.

Those extra fans will increase catering demand. 

Championship clubs get more TV money than L1 

More fans and playing at higher levels, generally correlate with more sponsorship, merchandise sales and hospitality income. 

Shankland was their top striker last season and you and others are suggesting he's not only SP quality, he's spend money on him SP quality. Yet you don't think Ayr could think he'll be a handy tool in their campaign to get them a better league finish? :rolleyes:

Shankland for £100k or under or £50k and Mullen are the two suggestions I've seen on here and they're laughable. 

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2 minutes ago, shull said:

Not just a bit bored Bazil. 

I hope I get a hire to the Erskine Bridge. 

 

I agree, very boring, it shouldn't even be a discussion topic. Unless you also think Shanks is coming home for £100k? :lol:

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1 minute ago, bazil85 said:

Again, I know you struggle. My point is that keeping them in the Championship for an extra season is worth more. How do you propose they get Championship 8th/ 10th place prize money by playing in League 1? :blink:

So taking that into account, back to £130,900. Policing, Stewarding costs I wouldn't imagine are an extra £30k for 300 fans, although feel free to evidence if you disagree.

Those extra fans will increase catering demand. 

Championship clubs get more TV money than L1 

More fans and playing at higher levels, generally correlate with more sponsorship, merchandise sales and hospitality income. 

Shankland was their top striker last season and you and others are suggesting he's not only SP quality, he's spend money on him SP quality. Yet you don't think Ayr could think he'll be a handy tool in their campaign to get them a better league finish? :rolleyes:

Shankland for £100k or under or £50k and Mullen are the two suggestions I've seen on here and they're laughable. 

Yeah, I struggle. 

You know they get prize money for finishing 10th yeah? That's what we're measuring here. Going down will also cost them, but seeing as they probably budget for that, it wouldn't be a great setback - most players on 1 year deals (including Shankland).

TV money is negligible, as is sponsorship difference between the two leagues.

He is certainly a handy tool, but although he scored bucketloads at League 1 level, his scoring record in the Chamionship is 14 goals in 64 games, so it's by no means certain he'll score freely this season for a struggling side. You disagree, which is fine, but it's more likely he could faill to hit double figures in the Championship. Not saying he will, just that it's more likely given his previous record for bigger clubs than Ayr.

The main crux of this whole argument is that Shankland would go if someone offered Ayr Utd £100k. Hardly laughable, as it's what most on here would probably guess would be what he would go for. Stevie Mallan went for what? £250k last summer? Nobody started doing a cost analysis of how much we'd make if he stayed and we went up - it was a price we had to take at that point, for a player who cost us nothing. Ayr are a much smaller club than us, so their tipping point is much lower, and £100k  would do it in my opinion.

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11 minutes ago, proudtobeabuddy said:

Why would he come back to us? JR got rid and i'm sure that was a blow to his confidence. Will AS sign someone who is doing well at a lower level and hope he does the business at Premier level? Doubt it!

We have signed half a team from lower English leagues in the hope they will do the business. 

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26 minutes ago, Soctty said:

Yeah, I struggle. 

You know they get prize money for finishing 10th yeah? That's what we're measuring here. Going down will also cost them, but seeing as they probably budget for that, it wouldn't be a great setback - most players on 1 year deals (including Shankland).

TV money is negligible, as is sponsorship difference between the two leagues.

He is certainly a handy tool, but although he scored bucketloads at League 1 level, his scoring record in the Chamionship is 14 goals in 64 games, so it's by no means certain he'll score freely this season for a struggling side. You disagree, which is fine, but it's more likely he could faill to hit double figures in the Championship. Not saying he will, just that it's more likely given his previous record for bigger clubs than Ayr.

The main crux of this whole argument is that Shankland would go if someone offered Ayr Utd £100k. Hardly laughable, as it's what most on here would probably guess would be what he would go for. Stevie Mallan went for what? £250k last summer? Nobody started doing a cost analysis of how much we'd make if he stayed and we went up - it was a price we had to take at that point, for a player who cost us nothing. Ayr are a much smaller club than us, so their tipping point is much lower, and £100k  would do it in my opinion.

My point all along is Shanks could be the difference between them going down and staying up and staying up is worth more than £100k. I gave you evidence that a season in the Championship is worth more than £100k to Ayr than a season in L1. A stiker that people on here are saying is pay money SP quality? If you believe that, must believe he could be a game changer and potential difference maker in league position... 

Still more though aren't they?

Why should we pay £100k for him then? :rolleyes:

He would not go if someone offered Ayr £100k. Not only would Ayr say no based on the evidence I've provided you, he's turned down bigger teams to repay their loyalty. It would also have negative impact on their paying fans and players who no doubt had a lift in them securing, what was a great coup for this season. 

Mallan went for £250k with St Mirren not in a massively different situation to Ayr and Shanks, but you think the difference between 7th place Championship & 1st place L1 is 150% :lol: even considering, he's just signed the contract and he seems to have continued his scoring for fun ways from last season. 

You're clearly at it. 

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Just now, bazil85 said:

My point all along is Shanks could be the difference between them going down and staying up and staying up is worth more than £100k. I gave you evidence that a season in the Championship is worth more than £100k to Ayr than a season in L1. A stiker that people on here are saying is pay money SP quality? If you believe that, must believe he could be a game changer and potential difference maker in league position... 

In English please...

Still more though aren't they?

If this refers to the first paragraph, I've no idea...

Why should we pay £100k for him then? :rolleyes:

He would not go if someone offered Ayr £100k. Not only would Ayr say no based on the evidence I've provided you, he's turned down bigger teams to repay their loyalty. It would also have negative impact on their paying fans and players who no doubt had a lift in them securing, what was a great coup for this season. 

Firstly, I don't think he'd come to us, as we could be back in the Championship next season given we're only just up, and it's difficult to stay up.

Secondly, if an established Premiership team came in for him, he would go, and Ayr would say yes because they would have a player wanting to leave, who could leave for nothing in the summer, and sign a PCA in January.

Mallan went for £250k with St Mirren not in a massively different situation to Ayr and Shanks, but you think the difference between 7th place Championship & 1st place L1 is 150% :lol: even considering, he's just signed the contract and he seems to have continued his scoring for fun ways from last season. 

Genuinely no idea what this gibberish is you're typing now.

You're clearly at it. 

Any chance you could try a second draft? All of it in English this time please...

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15 minutes ago, Soctty said:

Any chance you could try a second draft? All of it in English this time please...

It's all very clear, I know you're pedantic about English on a fan forum but if you require simplification. (even futher wow)

Playing in leagues further up the pyramid, generate clubs more money :rolleyes: In the case of Ayr, that figure, as evidenced is more than £100k. 

Sponsorship, merch, corporate, etc generate more income when clubs are in higher leagues

I have no doubt Ayr wouldn't stand in his way if a fair offer was to come in. The whole point is to say £100k is fair for your top goalscorer who has pledged to stay for another year at least is complete nonsense. 

I'm saying your estimation that Shanks is worth less than half what Mallan was worth to us is clearly garbage. 

Do you get it now? Is my English on a fan forum good enough for you? :lol:

Edited by bazil85

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