div Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Wonder how much it would cost to convert say one section of the West Stand into a "Safe Standing" area like the one described here; Would have a big positive impact on the atmosphere at the stadium IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kemp Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Says in that clip that they "want to follow the Scottish example..." Have I missed something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Agree Div, but as I just mentioned on the feeshal' forum in another thread, it takes our club over a year to replace a shabby missing letter from the main stadium sign, and we're hurtling towards five years at the new stadium with an as yet undeveloped main stand void, and who knows how long it will take, or who will be bothered, to update the HoF panels around the ground to reflect the addition of the latest inductees? Safe standing? Excuse me while I refrain from holding my breath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kemp Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 The clip also peddles this bullshit that terracing was to blame for Hillsborough disaster. We don't even need those rail seats, stick a normal old fashioned terracing in the West Bank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
div Posted August 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Says in that clip that they "want to follow the Scottish example..." Have I missed something? Safe standing was approved by the SPL in 2011. That said it would need the police/council to also endorse it; http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/16248937 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linwood buddie Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 The clip also peddles this bullshit that terracing was to blame for Hillsborough disaster. We don't even need those rail seats, stick a normal old fashioned terracing in the West Bank. The fencing the English put up in their stadiums because of the violence of their fans ,which stopped the fans getting out was to blame for Hillsborough ,I can still remember the tv coverage that day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kemp Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Surprised nobody has done anything about it. Certainly think the first club to do it would see a boost in away attendances at least. I suppose it could be a costly exercise though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
div Posted August 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 The clip also peddles this bullshit that terracing was to blame for Hillsborough disaster. We don't even need those rail seats, stick a normal old fashioned terracing in the West Bank. I think it's safe to say that, leaving Hillsborough aside, "old fashioned" packed terracing WAS dangerous. This is a reasonable alternative IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
div Posted August 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Surprised nobody has done anything about it. Certainly think the first club to do it would see a boost in away attendances at least. I suppose it could be a costly exercise though. Don't want to benefit the visiting fans, only our own. The stadium is like a morgue ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kemp Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Convert to terracing, boost the capacity, give the away fans part of the west stand and get a fence in like in the North Bank. Would soon get some atmosphere going! Never going to happen sadly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linwood buddie Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 The only bit of a downside IMO ,would be less seats getting used and this would make the stadium look emptier ,I know if I had the choice I would go to a terraced section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthSection5 Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Safe Standing can be done very successfully, and isn't too expensive to do adapt the stadium. Germany should be the example that we follow - they have done it incredibly well over there. Only problem that I can see is the fact that although it's not too expensive, it will still cost money, and I don't think Gilmour would go for anything that would potentially put us in debt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorizaar Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Would be amazed if any council granted safety certificates to such areas. Its a big leap from the current requirements of seating at all times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scabby Dug Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Surprised nobody has done anything about it. Certainly think the first club to do it would see a boost in away attendances at least. I suppose it could be a costly exercise though. Aberdeen had a portion at the back of their away stand for safe standing last season, but their stewards caused problems with the people standing BEFORE the game started. The Celtic fans do it St Mirren park when they visit as well, but they are a law unto themselves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kemp Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 That's not "safe standing" Scabby, thats just folk standing up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
civilsaint Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Wonder how much it would cost to convert say one section of the West Stand into a "Safe Standing" area like the one described here; Would have a big positive impact on the atmosphere at the stadium IMO. Wouldn't have a problem with this provided any required modifications to the stadium are entirely covered by an increase in ticket prices for such an area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isabella Duke Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 The fencing the English put up in their stadiums because of the violence of their fans ,which stopped the fans getting out was to blame for Hillsborough ,I can still remember the tv coverage that day. Whatever it was that was causing the fans to need to "get out" surely caused Hillsborough? I think its safe to say that if Hillsborough had been all seated then that disaster would not have happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddiecat Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 by all means have a standing area, but if it involves extra cost - forget it, use any money we get to bring in much needed players, then think about standing areas, i'm a bit too long in the tooth for standing up for 90 minutes but i can see that a standing area would allow the younger fans to be all in one place therefore creating more noise/chanting, i wonder if non allocated seating in w6 might have the same effect ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linwood buddie Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Whatever it was that was causing the fans to need to "get out" surely caused Hillsborough? I think its safe to say that if Hillsborough had been all seated then that disaster would not have happened. It was caused by many more fans than the capacity could handle getting in through a gate ,I don't think seats would have made a bit of difference ,or do you think they would all have stopped and went back out because the seats were all taken ?. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isabella Duke Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 i wonder if non allocated seating in w6 might have the same effect ? That indeed is all that is needed. Not sure how they go about it however. The area in the North Bank at Love Street was more or less taken up by those wishing to make a noise and those wishing a quieter time sat further away. Unfortunately, the club did not manage the move to the new ground particularly well in that respect, albeit I'm not too sure how they could have created a noisy section upon the move? The chance is gone now however, long term season ticket holders have their seat and it will now be impossible to move folk. Filling in the home end corner with a safe standing section would be a good idea. Its never going to happen though. Sit in your seats and shut yer faces! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isabella Duke Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 It was caused by many more fans than the capacity could handle getting in through a gate ,I don't think seats would have made a bit of difference ,or do you think they would all have stopped and went back out because the seats were all taken ?. You said in your first post that it was caused by the fences. Now you are saying it was caused because there were more fans than the capacity could handle? Seats take up more space than standing. They reduce the capacity of grounds. That in itself would have averted the disaster because fewer tickets would have been sold for the game and fewer folk would have turned up! The point about seats is that everyone has an allocated and specific seat, the capacity is reduced and everyone has space... unlike standing where it is a free for all and folk were packed in like sardines! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linwood buddie Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 You said in your first post that it was caused by the fences. Now you are saying it was caused because there were more fans than the capacity could handle? Seats take up more space than standing. They reduce the capacity of grounds. That in itself would have averted the disaster because fewer tickets would have been sold for the game and fewer folk would have turned up! The point about seats is that everyone has an allocated and specific seat, the capacity is reduced and everyone has space... unlike standing where it is a free for all and folk were packed in like sardines! Think it would have been obvious to anyone that read the posts that the fencing was a big part in the disaster with the exception of yourself ,as for packing fans in like sardines the turnstiles had counters that alerted the staff that the area had reached its capacity ,that is why they were closed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 (edited) You said in your first post that it was caused by the fences. Now you are saying it was caused because there were more fans than the capacity could handle? It was both of those things and more. The sum of a string of errors and failures all contributed to the disaster. Crushing was commonplace at most games anyway and the clever ones stood with their backs to the barriers to prevent it. Interestingly, bringing in seats removed the problem at a stroke. I don't recall any crush disasters at any all seater football ground in the UK since they were introduced but I may be wrong. As for this idea? Fundamentally I'm opposed to all standing at football matches. I just don't see the point of it. The idea that somehow more people will miraculously pay £20 to get to matches is just fantasy. That also goes for the idea that people will miraculously start singing again. The whole thing just looks like a pointless and hugely expensive exercise in trying to recoup the past. It won't improve attendances or the atmosphere. Only better performances will do that. Edited August 18, 2013 by oaksoft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linwood buddie Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 Sorry to say Linwood Buddie, that on this occasion Isabella is correct. I was in the Leppings Lane before and after the disaster as an away supporter and imho there is no way that disaster would have occurred with seats. There are detailed books such as Hillsborough The Truth which highlight the major issues. Personally I like the German model for football and we should look to implement their systems including the 50+1 fan ownership and strict laws on financial control. ETA. Your point on the fences is valid, but the failure of the Police at many levels that day resulted in significant loss of life. You were there and will know a lot more than me or many people about what happened , my point is from watching it develop at the time , even if the area had been seated was the that the amount of people who entered once the gates reopened would still have caused panic ,and injuries probably not many deaths ,the fences would still have stopped any getting out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aldo_j Posted August 18, 2013 Report Share Posted August 18, 2013 From memory, I believe after the announcement from the SPL Gilmour said the we couldn't just take seats out the ground and allow standing. Something to do with the depth of the steps, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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