shull Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 So Farewell Then the Petro - Chemical Bit. Hunners of jobs to go. Are the Unions there aw fannies ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shull Posted October 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Guy on the Tranny seems to think the Unions have slit the throats of the employees by encouraging a rejection of a rescue plan for the Site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSS Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Ah well,maybe Falkirk will be able to complete their Stadium now!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Guy on the Tranny seems to think the Unions have slit the throats of the employees by encouraging a rejection of a rescue plan for the Site. FFS, it is called trying to protect your members' terms and conditions. It is what unions are there to do. Also worth bearing in mind that unions are their members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melmac Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Aye, the turkeys voted for christmas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidg Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 FFS, it is called trying to protect your members' terms and conditions. It is what unions are there to do. Also worth bearing in mind that unions are their members. I hire plant in there so it's a big blow to me. The workers don't believe the plant is really making the loss the accounts state as they ship a chunk of the chemicals produced to his other continental sites which are very profitable. Feel sorry for the workers, more so the sub contractors on site who work for a fraction of the Ineos staff. They reckon 10,000 could be lost through the contractor & supply chain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Aye, the turkeys voted for christmas. What would you have suggested they do? Perhaps you should count yourself fortunate that you weren't in their position. The notion that this was a viable deal is a bit far-fetched in any event. Ineos clearly want to shut the plant down, and used the dispute with a shop steward to bring the matter to head and then offer Hobson's Choice to the workforce. Oh, and factor in how long the staff were given to make their 'choice', and this gives you a measure of the kind of people we're talking about, here. It is a despicable act of betrayal of a loyal workforce on the part of the company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 I hire plant in there so it's a big blow to me. The workers don't believe the plant is really making the loss the accounts state as they ship a chunk of the chemicals produced to his other continental sites which are very profitable. Feel sorry for the workers, more so the sub contractors on site who work for a fraction of the Ineos staff. They reckon 10,000 could be lost through the contractor & supply chain. It is sickening (though some people are more likely to be concerned about their ability to fill up their motors than the impact on the workers, their families, and the local communities and other contractors). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beyond our ken Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Aye, the turkeys voted for christmas. That's harsh. I hope you dont have to make that choice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shull Posted October 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Thanks all ! Company to blame. All sorted. Wish i hudnae started this. What a bore already. Everybody to blame apart from the Unions as usual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidg Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Keep the thread open shull... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Nipper Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 What would you have suggested they do? Perhaps you should count yourself fortunate that you weren't in their position. The notion that this was a viable deal is a bit far-fetched in any event. Ineos clearly want to shut the plant down, and used the dispute with a shop steward to bring the matter to head and then offer Hobson's Choice to the workforce. Oh, and factor in how long the staff were given to make their 'choice', and this gives you a measure of the kind of people we're talking about, here. It is a despicable act of betrayal of a loyal workforce on the part of the company. Liquidation................for the Chemicals plant.......................irony smiley alert I reckon civil war will break out amongst folk in Grangemouth ............a fifty / fifty split in approx terms on voting for the proposal. Terrible , but there are more faces and angles involved here than simply a greedy Chemicals manufacturer.................people I know directly involved are firmly blaming the union for completely underestimating Jim Ratcliffe and his team. The guy is a ruthless Entrepreneur and won't stand on ceremony, what does he owe Grangemouth. He has about fifty manufacturing sites throuhghout Euprope and beyond, so his view , why keep a sick asset. If people don't want the survival plan , bye...........................NEXT ! Feel for those who voted for a job for life on reduced pension , now loads of folk are looking at pennies in the pound................tragic, out their mortgaged homes for christmas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 In the event that anyone is still interested in what is a hugely significant development this morning, and wants to contribute anything by way of discussion (in light of shull's petulent outburst and subsequent closure of his earlier thread on account of other people not agreeing with him). Perhaps a moderator might opt to merge the two threads? Seems a shame to cut-off a discussion on the basis of a childish huff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Liquidation................for the Chemicals plant.......................irony smiley alert I reckon civil war will break out amongst folk in Grangemouth ............a fifty / fifty split in approx terms on voting for the proposal. Terrible , but there are more faces and angles involved here than simply a greedy Chemicals manufacturer.................people I know directly involved are firmly blaming the union for completely underestimating Jim Ratcliffe and his team. The guy is a ruthless Entrepreneur and won't stand on ceremony, what does he owe Grangemouth. He has about fifty manufacturing sites throuhghout Euprope and beyond, so his view , why keep a sick asset. If people don't want the survival plan , bye...........................NEXT ! Feel for those who voted for a job for life on reduced pension , now loads of folk are looking at pennies in the pound................tragic, out their mortgaged homes for christmas So, in effect, you are suggesting that private companies needn't have any sense of social responsiblity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beyond our ken Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 i still feel that the decision will be reversed somewhat, with a smaller staff having to accept reduced pay and new Ts& Cs that are less than those offered last week. Having worked there for a service provider, i can tell you that senior management were severely rattled when Innovene became Ineos, especially after they met the "shareholder". it's alright saying the staff should have accepted the deal, i had no doubt that accepting it would only have been the start of a cycle for them. Once you give a little to some people, you never end giving in to them. It was a hobson's choice, I'm afraid. The site management will be happy though, they will surely be in line for huge "termination bonuses" that will be increased according to how quickly and how deep they can cut. Can't say that i have been impressed by their demeanor over the last few weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 It is sickening (though some people are more likely to be concerned about their ability to fill up their motors than the impact on the workers, their families, and the local communities and other contractors). Drew can you give us a brief summary of what the unions had a problem with? To me it looks like it was over a pay freeze and pensions. Fighting pensions I can understand but fighting a pay freeze is madness. If I've got this wrong can you clarify? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Nipper Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 So, in effect, you are suggesting that private companies needn't have any sense of social responsiblity? Well, to a large extent , that is the brave new world we live in....................how do you engage someone like Jim Ratcliffe on social responsibility. Point is he did not walk away , he put a proposal to the plant , some people ( just about an influencial number ) said no. Imo that was very reckless Moving slightly futher forward, it is majorly ironic that a senior partner , possibly a potential major shareholder in the refinery could about to be China ...............well how does that social circle get squared Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shull Posted October 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 It was a guy on the radio you were disagreeing with. I couldnae give a stuff. As i said, Boring now and i reserve the right to shut the shite Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howard Hughes in BlueSuedeShoes Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Seeing as Shull has a huff masquerading as "freedom of speech" we can continue the discussion in here regarding the proposed closure of the Grangemouth Oil Refinery. Now, where were we? Oh aye. Managment; bunch of wankers. Unions; not their fault.Emdy got anything else on this one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 I blame Margaret Thatcher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Nipper Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Seeing as Shull has a huff masquerading as "freedom of speech" we can continue the discussion in here regarding the proposed closure of the Grangemouth Oil Refinery. Now, where were we? Oh aye. Managment; bunch of wankers. Unions; not their fault. Emdy got anything else on this one? Aye, tsk, its the Chemicals plant. The Oil Refinery is a completely seperate unit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howard Hughes in BlueSuedeShoes Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Goes without saying, Wilbur. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howard Hughes in BlueSuedeShoes Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Aye, tsk, its the Chemicals plant. The Oil Refinery is a completely seperate unit. Chemicals shmemicals, it's Grangemouth, let's start a heated debate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pod Posted October 23, 2013 Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Aye, tsk, its the Chemicals plant. The Oil Refinery is a completely seperate unit. http://www.itv.com/news/update/2013-10-23/grangemouth-oil-refinery-to-remain-open/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shull Posted October 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2013 Wish i was a Mod, i wid shut this shite tae. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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