Isle Of Bute Saint Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 Another shocking pointless murder in the name religion. One can not imagine the carnage that went on in that night club. RIP all those poor souls who were murdered when out enjoying what they thought would be a party night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 Totally appalling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 Another shocking pointless murder in the name religion. One can not imagine the carnage that went on in that night club. RIP all those poor souls who were murdered when out enjoying what they thought would be a party night. Do we know for sure that it was about religion? Hate, certainly, but we need to be careful not to jump to Trumped up conclusions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isle Of Bute Saint Posted June 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 Do we know for sure that it was about religion? Hate, certainly, but we need to be careful not to jump to Trumped up conclusions. Only going by what was on CNN Drew. The Gunman said it was in the name of ISIS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 Do we know for sure that it was about religion? Hate, certainly, but we need to be careful not to jump to Trumped up conclusions. He, seemingly, called 911 declaring his allegiance to Islamic State. An utter cnut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 Yes that's what he said , however is this not a Trump Card??, ideal timing, I think it was just a total sick fker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 I could commit an offence and claim allegiance to pretty much anything. It wouldn't mean that the offence was necessarily ideological. As DJ says, I suspect this was a sick, damaged individual, operating as a sick, damaged individual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaldyOzBud Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 According to an interview I watched featuring his ex wife today, he was indeed a damaged and violent individual with a pathological hatred of gays, it would seem to me that it may or may not be homophobia due to his religious affiliation, or just a homophobe with a severe mental illness. Either way it is a tragedy, and symptomatic of the American obsession with " The right to bear arms " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isle Of Bute Saint Posted June 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 I could commit an offence and claim allegiance to pretty much anything. It wouldn't mean that the offence was necessarily ideological. As DJ says, I suspect this was a sick, damaged individual, operating as a sick, damaged individual. Same could be said for the attacks in France and else where. The fact is a minority of Islamists take it too far on how they have been brought up reading the coran. Agree he was probably homophobic as well. But you individuals are reading online what propaganda ISIS put out and use their name. This won't be the last it's another case just like the marathon in Boston. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 (edited) Same could be said for the attacks in France and else where. The fact is a minority of Islamists take it too far on how they have been brought up reading the coran. Agree he was probably homophobic as well. But you individuals are reading online what propaganda ISIS put out and use their name. This won't be the last it's another case just like the marathon in Boston. Not at all alike, Ian. The critical difference is the fact that the attacks on Paris and Brussels were co-ordinated and perpetrated by a a group of people. That clearly indicates a shared ideology. This scenario is very different in that respect. Edited June 13, 2016 by Drew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 In one week, in Orlando, some sick fcuker shoots dead an innocent 22 year old lassie singer, then this? Maybe, as others have suggested, America seriously needs to look at itself, its attitude to bearing arms, and that is a more important issue than trying to figure out if this second sick fcuker was doing it because of a hatred of gays, or because of ISIS affiliated reasons. On a recent trip to Arizona, I spoke to someone who said armed raids on convenience stores in the state are relatively rare, because criminals know the shopkeepers all have loaded weapons to hand just beside the cash registers, and are as likely to blow their heads off as the criminal will the shopkeepers. Mutually assured destruction keeps the peace? As much as I love America, that logic is seriously fcuked! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isle Of Bute Saint Posted June 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 In one week, in Orlando, some sick fcuker shoots dead an innocent 22 year old lassie singer, then this? Maybe, as others have suggested, America seriously needs to look at itself, its attitude to bearing arms, and that is a more important issue than trying to figure out if this second sick fcuker was doing it because of a hatred of gays, or because of ISIS affiliated reasons. On a recent trip to Arizona, I spoke to someone who said armed raids on convenience stores in the state are relatively rare, because criminals know the shopkeepers all have loaded weapons to hand just beside the cash registers, and are as likely to blow their heads off as the criminal will the shopkeepers. Mutually assured destruction keeps the peace? As much as I love America, that logic is seriously fcuked! Agree gun laws in America are crazy problem is so many of the public think it's right to own a gun in the name of defence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FS Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 Like others here, I'm appalled at this latest US gun atrocity. And also like others, I'm not going to play the Trump card either, something him and his cronies are already indulging in. This was a sick and tainted individual with legally owned guns, who went berserk. Nothing more to it than that. People are saying well if he didn't have guns, he'd have gotten them illegally, or built a bomb or driven his jeep into the crowd... Maybe...but I think they've missed the point somewhat! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Nipper Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 Vigil in Glasgow tonight ? At the risk of sounding a bit crass, why ? Is this an expression of grief that I am not familiar with ? Should I begin to self loathe ? It's a horrendous thing that's happened in Orlando, but I'm not understanding the Glasgow vigil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 Vigil in Glasgow tonight ? At the risk of sounding a bit crass, why ? Is this an expression of grief that I am not familiar with ? Should I begin to self loathe ? It's a horrendous thing that's happened in Orlando, but I'm not understanding the Glasgow vigil. LGBT community and others expressing solidarity? I can't see any problem with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 18 times during his presidency Obama has had to go on tv following massacres. These broadcasts werent because of homophobia or terrorists or Islam or Christianity or long wolves or mental illness or people of any colour. It's because of the ease of access that Americans have to guns. The gun lobby seem to think that the solution is more people having guns. A fecked up country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treaclebreeks Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 You should not look at this from a uk perspective. Over here in rather sunny Monument Valley, one can absolutely see the US perspective. Possessing guns and the right to "defend yourself" is the only way it can possibly work in this vast country. The fact that Canada is not so f**ked up, not killing as many of their nation, their own people, does not possess a fraction of the weapons held in the US... ...is completely incomprehensible to the majority of the population here. Sigh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zurich_allan Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 (edited) Vigil in Glasgow tonight ? At the risk of sounding a bit crass, why ? Is this an expression of grief that I am not familiar with ? Should I begin to self loathe ? It's a horrendous thing that's happened in Orlando, but I'm not understanding the Glasgow vigil. Although I'm not sure if there are any British amongst the dead, there absolutely are British citizens who have been injured in the shooting.Also, showing solidarity at times like this is important. Edited June 14, 2016 by zurich_allan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 Vigil in Glasgow tonight ? At the risk of sounding a bit crass, why ? Is this an expression of grief that I am not familiar with ? Should I begin to self loathe ? It's a horrendous thing that's happened in Orlando, but I'm not understanding the Glasgow vigil. It looks like you've tried very hard not to understand why and be very crass. ???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 Although I'm not sure if there are any British amongst the dead, there absolutely are British citizens who have been injured in the shooting. Also, showing solidarity at times like this is important. Aye. Many LGBT folks feel part of a community that is international in reach. I think that's fine. People relate with others and come together for all kinds of reasons, and, in this instance, it seems to me to be many good reasons. Those of us who don't see ourselves as part of that community needn't concern ourselves about it. We St Mirren fans could be regarded as a community in many respects. If a pub full of Saints fans was the focal point for a tragedy like this, wouldn't we want to share grief and show solidarity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isle Of Bute Saint Posted June 14, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 You should not look at this from a uk perspective. Over here in rather sunny Monument Valley, one can absolutely see the US perspective. Possessing guns and the right to "defend yourself" is the only way it can possibly work in this vast country. The fact that Canada is not so f**ked up, not killing as many of their nation, their own people, does not possess a fraction of the weapons held in the US... ...is completely incomprehensible to the majority of the population here. Sigh. There are a lot of great things about America equally a lot of f**ked up things. Working in Alabama i experienced what its like for the blacks down there. One back guy with us and a few Americans had to ask permission to allow the back guy into a bar. He was allowed in but we had to sit at the door until the black guy left only then were we allowed to go right into the bar , what is that all about in the land of the free. One rig had 2 galleys one for back workers and one for white workers again was shocked by this. Have been in the west coast and up state New York where that kind of thing did not happen. As for guns like you I understand why guns are carried but of course do not agree with it , its a different culture. Most whites in South Africa carry guns , have been in a bar where people were searched guns carried were put in a security room then returned when the persons leave the bar. Yet in South Africa we don't see the mass shootings we see in america. As the saying goes we live in a mad world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 Although attitudes to the LBGT community have changed radically in my lifetime they are still persecuted simply due to their sexual preferences. I can understand the solidarity in Glasgow for people in their own community who were subject to such an outrage by a homophobe. I have travelled a lot but never been to America and really have little inclination to go. I cannot get my head around their macho and aggressive need for guns. Sick , sick people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 Although attitudes to the LBGT community have changed radically in my lifetime they are still persecuted simply due to their sexual preferences. I can understand the solidarity in Glasgow for people in their own community who were subject to such an outrage by a homophobe. I have travelled a lot but never been to America and really have little inclination to go. I cannot get my head around their macho and aggressive need for guns. Sick , sick people. Unfortunately there are a lot of Americas who are equally abhorred by the regular needless killings but they are powerless as the gun lobby are a powerful group, and supported by millions, many very rich and powerful. This outdated "right to keep and bear arms", aye mibbie in the days of cowboys, is still seen as a democratic right. Obama has tried to make significant changes and largely failed. It is hard for most of the UK to even come close to understanding the mentality but it is so ingrained it's hard to see things changing, even with the latest horrific event. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintnextlifetime Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 Guns don't kill people , people kill people . . People who want guns will always get them . . Gun crime has risen since we banned legally held guns here. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted June 14, 2016 Report Share Posted June 14, 2016 (edited) Guns don't kill people , people kill people . . People who want guns will always get them . . Gun crime has risen since we banned legally held guns here. . Only an absolute fool would deny that easy access to guns will lead to an increase in gun crime. Check the figures for the US and the UK and come back and justify this utter tripe. Edited June 14, 2016 by faraway saint Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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