Isle Of Bute Saint Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 where on these links does it say "some of this money has been taken from scottish taxpayers and they are getting skinned" this is just spin of a low order, we pay tax to hmrc, scotland is not independent and HM TREASURY is actually ours as well as the rest of the uks', so it's getting paid back to us (i.e. all uk taxpayers), i agree we might lose some of it to Ruk if we become independent = another reason to vote nobeen pressing away at the Wong buttons here probably because I'm in a bar here in Rotterdam lol. Getting rid of Faslane and stop sending our troops to fight in wars is a strong point alone to vote YES. Local people looking after local interests is another though you are probably getting bored now as you have heard it all before. Another fact is west coast oil and gas of which there is plenty have we to miss this golden opportunity a second time around ? Norway had no problems when the banks collapsed why ? Yes it has no faslanes or fighting every war America goes into. Your a unionist so I won't change your mind. There is a golden opportunity to stand on our own feet. Three quarters of British wealthy is in the South East ( fact ) jeez oh how many Scots can't see it surprises me. Though you probably think the why I can't see the unionist side ? Well specs avers helped me pay them a visit mate .) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 David Cameron opened his gob today. This means today I'm in a 'yes' voting frame of mind. I can't help it. When an English Tory gobshite Oxbridge wanker talks about Scotland, I can't help but come over in a bit of a cold sweat. I feel the same way when a born and bred Scottish Sevco supporting bawbag appears on TV wearing an England top.... If this makes me a bad man, guilty as charged M'lud. Certain types just give me the dry boak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 My figures were taken from gideons budget as reported via the daily mail. My figures were based on UK tory minister in government reported through right wing tory supporting newspaper. You have figures from a website, together with a reputation for talking shite and making up facts. Maybe we should both leave it over the weekend and wait for next week's budget My website was the UK Public Spending website which takes actual public spending figures from HM Treasury from their Public Expenditure Statistical Analysis. Straight from the horses mouth if you want it in plain speaking. You need to learn the difference between fact and reported opinion - and you certainly need to learn the difference between a website such as this one, and the kind of Der Sturmer Nationalist Blogs that you keep linking back to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 And to take that 1 step further for the even more astounding info that certainly will go ignored by the press.... £375bn of the (£1.38tn) debt is owed to our own Bank of England which holds UK government bonds/gilts which they bought through Quantitative Easing. That equates to approx 27% of the UK national debt. So from the £4.02bn removed from Scotland's account this year for servicing debt - approx. £1.08bn went to our own Bank of England. This cash has been accumulating in an account called APF and the BoE is then feeding this cash surplus back into..... HM Treasury. In other words - the Scottish tax-payer gets skinned again. https://www.gov.uk/government/news/changes-to-cash-management-operations http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-20268679 Jim Sillars talked about this on Question Time and he's absolutely right and I've stated it again on this thread several times over. A fair proportion of the UK National Debt is owed to the Treasury. Stick together and there's no issue and we'll quickly discover that rumours of the UK's fiscal demise was vastly over stated, split and well I suppose it will depend on how well the negotiations go. It's hardly a hidden issue though. I'm not sure what kind of viewing figures Question Time gets but I'm sure it's in the millions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 been pressing away at the Wong buttons here probably because I'm in a bar here in Rotterdam lol. Getting rid of Faslane and stop sending our troops to fight in wars is a strong point alone to vote YES. Local people looking after local interests is another though you are probably getting bored now as you have heard it all before. Another fact is west coast oil and gas of which there is plenty have we to miss this golden opportunity a second time around ? Norway had no problems when the banks collapsed why ? Yes it has no faslanes or fighting every war America goes into. Your a unionist so I won't change your mind. There is a golden opportunity to stand on our own feet. Three quarters of British wealthy is in the South East ( fact ) jeez oh how many Scots can't see it surprises me. Though you probably think the why I can't see the unionist side ? Well specs avers helped me pay them a visit mate .) 1. You won't "get rid" of Faslane. 2. Since Independence apparently means that Scotland will look to join NATO you will find that Scottish troops will still be sent to area's of conflict. 3. I don't understand this "local people looking after local interests" claim. My local councillors are far more local to me than Alex Salmond, John Swinney and Nicola Sturgeon. 4. There's a lot of shail gas in Lancashire. Do you want to miss out on that opportunity? 5. Their banks weren't as f**king stupid as the two main Scottish ones and they didn't have a First Minister keen to get one of their banks to pay silly prices for a bankrupt bank. 6. I'm standing on my own two feet - well mostly. Currently I'm sitting down. Many Scots like me were standing on our own two feet before 2000, and we've been doing it since 2000. It's a silly argument anyway since the White Paper makes it clear that an Independent Scotland won't be "standing on it's own two feet". Apparently we are going to copy the rest of the UK by letting their Bank set our interest rates, we're going to beg to use another countries currency, and we're going to try to join the EU so their courts can dictate our laws to us. 7. I think most people know that if you own property in the South East of England you are going to be classed as wealthy since property values down there are far higher to those across the rest of the country. There is a broom cupboard in London currently on the market for £1m. However that doesn't necessarily mean that they have more disposable income. There's a hell of a lot of people in the South East of England struggling to pay their bills, heat their homes and buy food. 8. I don't think you need specs - just a mind of your own. I hope you get one instead of just repeating the same old tired rhetoric that the Yes campaign have been pumping out since day one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 David Cameron opened his gob today. This means today I'm in a 'yes' voting frame of mind. I can't help it. When an English Tory gobshite Oxbridge wanker talks about Scotland, I can't help but come over in a bit of a cold sweat. I feel the same way when a born and bred Scottish Sevco supporting bawbag appears on TV wearing an England top.... If this makes me a bad man, guilty as charged M'lud. Certain types just give me the dry boak. Xenophobe!!! Come on Poz you are better than that..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FTOF Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 1. You won't "get rid" of Faslane. 2. Since Independence apparently means that Scotland will look to join NATO you will find that Scottish troops will still be sent to area's of conflict. 3. I don't understand this "local people looking after local interests" claim. My local councillors are far more local to me than Alex Salmond, John Swinney and Nicola Sturgeon. 4. There's a lot of shail gas in Lancashire. Do you want to miss out on that opportunity? 5. Their banks weren't as f**king stupid as the two main Scottish ones and they didn't have a First Minister keen to get one of their banks to pay silly prices for a bankrupt bank. 6. I'm standing on my own two feet - well mostly. Currently I'm sitting down. Many Scots like me were standing on our own two feet before 2000, and we've been doing it since 2000. It's a silly argument anyway since the White Paper makes it clear that an Independent Scotland won't be "standing on it's own two feet". Apparently we are going to copy the rest of the UK by letting their Bank set our interest rates, we're going to beg to use another countries currency, and we're going to try to join the EU so their courts can dictate our laws to us. 7. I think most people know that if you own property in the South East of England you are going to be classed as wealthy since property values down there are far higher to those across the rest of the country. There is a broom cupboard in London currently on the market for £1m. However that doesn't necessarily mean that they have more disposable income. There's a hell of a lot of people in the South East of England struggling to pay their bills, heat their homes and buy food. 8. I don't think you need specs - just a mind of your own. I hope you get one instead of just repeating the same old tired rhetoric that the Yes campaign have been pumping out since day one. Unmitigated drivel from start to finish. I can't believe you deprived a five year old kid somewhere in the world of the oxygen required to draw a stickman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 Unmitigated drivel from start to finish. I can't believe you deprived a five year old kid somewhere in the world of the oxygen required to draw a stickman. Drivel right enough from dicko, he's consistent if nothing else. I really can't be erse picking all that shite apart, however I do notice point 5 is something that he continues to rant on with and I don't think I've bothered with it before, do here goes. Regarding rbs purchase of Abn Amro, while dicko likes to blame Salmond for this it was actually the Westminster chancellor, a certain Mr Darling who approved the deal - he was legally required to say yey or ney to it. Fred Goodwin was also an advisor to Darling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 A thought occurred to me ( it's that time of the year). If we're being selfish by wanting independence and looking after ourselves while ignoring many others like us, how come it's all Thatcher's disciples telling us not to go there? I've just realised why I don't like thinking....... Profound - what substances have you been imbibing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 where on these links does it say "some of this money has been taken from scottish taxpayers and they are getting skinned" this is just spin of a low order, we pay tax to hmrc, scotland is not independent and HM TREASURY is actually ours as well as the rest of the uks', so it's getting paid back to us (i.e. all uk taxpayers), i agree we might lose some of it to Ruk if we become independent = another reason to vote noMy take on it is that yes all uk taxpayers pay money to treasury however Scotland as a country has to pay monies back in form of interest payments on debt. However the other parts of UK dont as they don't get the pocket money payment from treasury. So although the debt"exists" between BOE and uk treasury and in theory could be construed as paper debt not physical, scotland still has to currently pay it's share of the interest on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 My website was the UK Public Spending website which takes actual public spending figures from HM Treasury from their Public Expenditure Statistical Analysis. Straight from the horses mouth if you want it in plain speaking. You need to learn the difference between fact and reported opinion - and you certainly need to learn the difference between a website such as this one, and the kind of Der Sturmer Nationalist Blogs that you keep linking back to. More irony from Billy liar. Can you genuinely not stop spouting pish and lying, or do you not realise your talking shite?The website you reference is not an official UK gov website. It's an opinion site. Now I know the daily mail isn't the most reliable when it comes to telling the truth but the articles I referenced at least quoted gov facts and spokesmen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 (edited) More irony from Billy liar. Can you genuinely not stop spouting pish and lying, or do you not realise your talking shite? The website you reference is not an official UK gov website. It's an opinion site. Now I know the daily mail isn't the most reliable when it comes to telling the truth but the articles I referenced at least quoted gov facts and spokesmen. I know it's not an official government site - however if you read the data sheet it tells you exactly where the data is drawn from and I've quoted it directly. You on the other hand are posting hearsay written by a journalist who's listened to a speech, or read a press release which could be designed to say absolutely anything. I would have thought you'd have woken up to that fact with all that shite propaganda you keep reading. Edited March 14, 2014 by Stuart Dickson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salmonbuddie Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Profound - what substances have you been imbibing The scary thing is that I was sober when this thought occurred to me. Opened a bottle of wine as soon as I read it back to myself, though...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shull Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 As the talk goes on the roads remain unsmooth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 (edited) As the talk goes on the roads remain unsmooth. 123 pages of absolute shite, squabbling and trolling and finally a real issue is raised. I reckon as part of Big Society, everyone should simply get a spade, a bag of cement and fill in one hole themselves. It costs less than a tenner, would boost the economy and would give people a sense of empowerment. I realise these are big words but the alternative of "get oot yer cab, fill wan in and stop yer fecking whinin" seemed....well.....rude to be honest. Actually I've decided that I'm right over this. Ask not what your council can do for you. Ask what you can do.......etc. BTW 123 pages showing proof of the inability of people to behave like reasonable human beings to each other when you allow them to do things under a cloak of anonymity. Edited March 15, 2014 by oaksoft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shull Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 (edited) Gie me the resources and i'll dae it. There are 19 potholes in my 100 yard street. I'll start with them. Edited March 15, 2014 by shull Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Gie me the resources and i'll dae it. You already have the resources. A cab to drive to Homebase and a credit card with available credit on it. Good luck. Let us know how it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shull Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 You already have the resources. A cab to drive to Homebase and a credit card with available credit on it. Good luck. Let us know how it goes. On my way, i'll just use cash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 On my way, i'll just use cash. When you get there, ask at reception for Senga and say Pea says hello. She'll know what that means. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluto Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 (edited) Flawed thinking, neither practical, nor scientific although I applaud the intention. Filling holes in road surfaces with cement will generate far more damage than it heals. The periphery of such cement holes will soon erode and leave an increasing moat around the cement plugs. Producing a bigger, more difficult and costly repair job to be undertaken. Edited March 15, 2014 by bluto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Flawed thinking, neither practical, nor scientific although I applaud the intention. Filling holes in road surfaces with cement will generate far more damage than it heals. The periphery of such cement holes will soon erode and leave an increasing moat around the cement plugs. Producing a bigger, more difficult and costly repair job to be undertaken. Thank you, Bob the builder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluto Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Thank you, Bob the builder. I thought oaky was way off topic...... but the most interesting post on this thread for some time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beyond our ken Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 I'll keep this short and to the point as I'm not interested in entering into any more debate resulting in name calling etc. I agree with a substantial amount of what's written at the link, especially on the likely first step of attempting to negotiate via an intergovernmental conference (a European Summit). And I also agree on the impracticality of Scottish citizens being removed as EU citizens, however there is still one definite flaw; that the other Member States CANNOT be forced to agree to treaty amendments and associated increases in Commissioners, Ministers etc. In short, although it would be impractical to have EU citizenship removed from existing citizens, it would be ILLEGAL to enforce a treaty change if any Member State opposed the negotiations either before or during the process. In that circumstance, and again I am not saying it would happen, hopefully things would not get messy like that, it would HAVE to be a phased withdrawal (likely on the same terms as a Member State voluntarily leaving i.e. a 2-3 year withdrawal process on negotiated terms) pending re-entry, we cannot illegally force our way into a democratic union. AGAIN - I am not saying we would fail in our negotiations, it is a worst case scenario, but a real one that has not been mentioned at the link and should have been to give the full story and not a partial picture. I would debate and defend this point with any EU expert in the world, I am that confident in the accuracy of this point. Aside from that, whilst I would change some of the terminology (and actually some of the informal wording used i.e. 'hardly'), I agree with most of the actual substance in terms of the likely procedures and timings etc. If you look back on the thread, I said pretty much the same thing about carefully planning the timing of negotiations and accession etc so as to allow a seemless transition as that would avoid many problems. I love your hystrical reaction, how many times are you going to post with the caveat that you are not interested in debate? I'll jog your memory, you answered a serious and sincere question that i put to you with a rant about people being stupid and gullible and inferrd that i had an entrenched view, which is bollocks, i was genuinely interested in the rationale behind your statement as it challenged my understanding. when you responded to my question in such a hysterical, insulting and self-important way, did you really expect me not to react? It's a bit much to constantly express these feelings when you only reaped what you sowed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickMcD Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 I love your hystrical reaction, how many times are you going to post with the caveat that you are not interested in debate? I'll jog your memory, you answered a serious and sincere question that i put to you with a rant about people being stupid and gullible and inferrd that i had an entrenched view, which is bollocks, i was genuinely interested in the rationale behind your statement as it challenged my understanding. when you responded to my question in such a hysterical, insulting and self-important way, did you really expect me not to react? It's a bit much to constantly express these feelings when you only reaped what you sowed. Are you sure he was talking to you? I thought a few guys had already claImed the credit/blame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beyond our ken Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Are you sure he was talking to you? I thought a few guys had already claImed the credit/blame. Well he chose to quote my post when making his point. if he wasnt referring to me then fair enough-but that was ill-judged at best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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