Stuart Dickson Posted August 29, 2014 Report Share Posted August 29, 2014 I'm no fan of Jim Murphy's politics. However this was the man hailed as a hero by witnesses at the Clutha Bar disaster in December 2013 - credited with helping to save many lives. He was one of the first people on the scene. Does he deserve the label of "terrorist", "collaborator" or "paedophile"? And do normal members of the public deserve to be intimidated, threatened, heckled, harassed and bullied just for asking Jim Murphy a question. I don't like the look of this kind of Independent Scotland one little bit. I suspect even the Nazi's in 1930's Germany might have been shocked at the disgraceful scenes on the streets in Scotland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insaintee Posted August 29, 2014 Report Share Posted August 29, 2014 (edited) Aye ,that's exactly what happens................................. Hing on, I need to ask insaintee what channel to watch tonight. PM sent Edited August 29, 2014 by insaintee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Bundy Posted August 29, 2014 Report Share Posted August 29, 2014 I'm no fan of Jim Murphy's politics. However this was the man hailed as a hero by witnesses at the Clutha Bar disaster in December 2013 - credited with helping to save many lives. He was one of the first people on the scene. Does he deserve the label of "terrorist", "collaborator" or "paedophile"? And do normal members of the public deserve to be intimidated, threatened, heckled, harassed and bullied just for asking Jim Murphy a question. I don't like the look of this kind of Independent Scotland one little bit. I suspect even the Nazi's in 1930's Germany might have been shocked at the disgraceful scenes on the streets in Scotland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluto Posted August 29, 2014 Report Share Posted August 29, 2014 my contention is that in an independent Scotland, the Scots will get the government that is voted for by the majority of Scots.. no more.. and no less!And yet.... And yet.... The call for a naff un-independent , under-represented Scotland (if that ever possibly happened) would have been voted for by an electorate that will have been (whatever the result) composed of all sorts of people who are not Scots, who just happen to be living there for the duration of the vote, whilst real, palpable genuine Scots are denied a vote.Your contention is, in my humble but aggrieved opinion, bollocks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E=Mc2 Posted August 29, 2014 Report Share Posted August 29, 2014 Hmmm... As someone once said... "It would appear that the majority of prospective No voters' choice is based on their perception of personal gain/loss (greed).. Wheras, the majority of prospective YES voters' choice is based on common decency". Why do you think the SNP keep saying it's Scotland's oil and not Britain's oil? Is that not the SNP looking after their own? Or is that the SNP doing the decent thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Bundy Posted August 29, 2014 Report Share Posted August 29, 2014 Why do you think the SNP keep saying it's Scotland's oil and not Britain's oil? Is that not the SNP looking after their own? Or is that the SNP doing the decent th Why do you think the SNP keep saying it's Scotland's oil and not Britain's oil? Is that not the SNP looking after their own? Or is that the SNP doing the decent thing? Free Palestine or Free Scotland - We have a choice Gaza Does Not ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaldyOzBud Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 And yet.... And yet.... The call for a naff un-independent , under-represented Scotland (if that ever possibly happened) would have been voted for by an electorate that will have been (whatever the result) composed of all sorts of people who are not Scots, who just happen to be living there for the duration of the vote, whilst real, palpable genuine Scots are denied a vote. Your contention is, in my humble but aggrieved opinion, bollocks. And we are all entitled to our own opinion, you and I both live outwith Scotland and don't have a vote ( rightly or wrongly ) but Scottish residents of many different nationalities do. I don't have a problem with that because I think that the people who live and work in a country are entitled to a government that will be elected by the people ( residents ) of that country. This may turn out to be a good thing for the BT campaign, because where I'm living is full of expats, I've spoken about this to a couple of dozen of them over the last few months and I'm yet to find anyone who would have voted no if they had the vote, and none of them have even met a fellow scot living here in Melbourne who was not 100% for independence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insaintee Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 (edited) And yet.... And yet.... The call for a naff un-independent , under-represented Scotland (if that ever possibly happened) would have been voted for by an electorate that will have been (whatever the result) composed of all sorts of people who are not Scots, who just happen to be living there for the duration of the vote, whilst real, palpable genuine Scots are denied a vote. Your contention is, in my humble but aggrieved opinion, bollocks. You're not Scottish. get over it ETA Edited August 30, 2014 by insaintee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintnextlifetime Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 And yet.... And yet.... The call for a naff un-independent , under-represented Scotland (if that ever possibly happened) would have been voted for by an electorate that will have been (whatever the result) composed of all sorts of people who are not Scots, who just happen to be living there for the duration of the vote, whilst real, palpable genuine Scots are denied a vote. Your contention is, in my humble but aggrieved opinion, bollocks. Thing is bluto , there are palpable genuine Scots all over the planet and it wouldn't be practical to give them all the vote , same as they don't get a vote here at a general election. . I'm a British subject , not proud of it , While I carry the Burden of Shame. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Anyway, I'm back to undecided...................with a slant towards NAW! We're all f**king gripped with excitement. Please inform us immediately when you make your mind up. Personally I won't sleep until I know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 (edited) And yet.... And yet.... The call for a naff un-independent , under-represented Scotland (if that ever possibly happened) would have been voted for by an electorate that will have been (whatever the result) composed of all sorts of people who are not Scots, who just happen to be living there for the duration of the vote, whilst real, palpable genuine Scots are denied a vote. Those people contribute FAR more to Scotland right now than you do and therefore their opinion is more valid than yours. You chose to leave Scotland for another country for personal gain. Just like you can't divorce your wife and expect to still have a say in what she does, neither can you walk aweay from our country and expect to control what we do when you've gone. Accept it. Or not. It's your choice. Either way take Rick with you FFS. Edited August 30, 2014 by oaksoft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 We're all f**king gripped with excitement. Please inform us immediately when you make your mind up. Personally I won't sleep until I know. OK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Yet another day of silence from the Nationalists with no condemnation of the kind of behaviour shown by supposed "Yes" Supporters at those Jim Murphy rallies both towards Jim Murphy and the bullying and intimidation shown to general members of the public. No apology or attempt at denial from the Yes Campaign Officials who were implicated in the video of organising the rent a mob. The evidence is all there in the video. I really don't fancy the idea of post independence democracy in Scotland if this is an example of what it might be like. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDi1OXJn4Vw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 The evidence? Editing footage to make it appear say what you want. Propaganda that Goebbles, or even the British State would be proud of...oh, wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 The evidence? Editing footage to make it appear say what you want. Propaganda that Goebbles, or even the British State would be proud of...oh, wait. Dear oh dear. Does the Yes Campaign organise hoardes of knuckle scrapers to come along to Yes rallies to intimidate those attending? The anti democracy element in this referendum are all Yes Supporters - it's extremely evident especially when you know that it was Westminster who approved and sanctioned the referendum in the first f**king place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Dicko meltdown approaching... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Dicko meltdown approaching... I'm perfectly calm. Remember it wasn't me that went running to the moderators about "names" that you may or may not be calling me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 I'm perfectly calm. Remember it wasn't me that went running to the moderators about "names" that you may or may not be calling me Another dicko misrepresentaction... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Another dicko misrepresentaction... Surely not. I had all the Nationalists down as the alias of one person..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chookie Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Dear oh dear. Does the Yes Campaign organise hoardes of knuckle scrapers to come along to Yes rallies to intimidate those attending? The anti democracy element in this referendum are all Yes Supporters - it's extremely evident especially when you know that it was Westminster who approved and sanctioned the referendum in the first f**king place. Politicians, good or bad, have been egged or have had rotten veg. Thrown at them for years. Nothing is new here, nothing at all. The anti democracy element is available on both sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Politicians, good or bad, have been egged or have had rotten veg. Thrown at them for years. Nothing is new here, nothing at all. The anti democracy element is available on both sides. I agree with you when it comes to eggs but what really is new, in Scotland at the very least, is the campaign leadership organised mob bullying and intimidation of - not the politicians - but of normal every day people who are simply looking to speak to the politician, perhaps to glean some facts that might help them decide what way to vote. It's the kind of thing that was prevalent in Germany in the 1930's when the Fascists and the Communists regularly tried to infiltrate each others meetings to create disorder and disturbances. You'd think the same leaders who have organised these mobs would realise the kind of damage they are doing to their own campaign, but nope. It appears it's a tactic that the Yes Campaign like, endorse and want to encourage. The anti democratic element is quite definitely on the Nationalist side - as I've said that is obvious especially since it was the Unionist Parties at Westminster who sanctioned the referendum despite their being absolutely no obligation on them to do so Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluto Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 (edited) Those people contribute FAR more to Scotland right now than you do and therefore their opinion is more valid than yours. You chose to leave Scotland for another country for personal gain. Just like you can't divorce your wife and expect to still have a say in what she does, neither can you walk aweay from our country and expect to control what we do when you've gone. Accept it. Or not. It's your choice. Either way take Rick with you FFS. Unsurprisingly, so much derisory insane assumption that I shouldn't be tempted to respond but 5 minutes of mild amusement and corrective text beckons.How do "those people" (I assume you mean foreign students and immigrants seeking work) contribute more to Scotland right now, given that I have worked three weeks a month since April in Scotland, spending above 2grand a week - not including food, transport and accommodation - on showing other foreign people how wonderful Scotland is? Not forgetting that I have a lifetime of being Scottish and an understanding of the land and its society, that is way beyond anything "those people " could ever have.... And most Scots, too. (Btw SNLT, the French are able to have their ex-pats Nationals vote in their elections, so it's not beyond the wit of Scotland to also achieve this. It was a political decision of Yes-men, just as giving the vote to 16yo was. I understand their gamble, but don't think it will work) Back to the madman... This personal gain.... in this current work I do, I actually earn less than I could by doing other stuff in London... Because I chose to do so. Similarly, in the early 70s, I left £70 a day work in London for £20 a week in the north of Scotland. I may have missed that a factor in voting qualification was related to pursuit of personal gain and personal wealth - so am I to assume that after Sep 18, Capitalism will be abolished in Scotland? And just to be clear, I didn't leave the country, I stayed in the UK and went to London. I don't have a wife. If my woman and I were to consider splitting, it would be as a mutual action, after shared consideration of problems in our relationship that we would maturely discuss, address and try to fix. That is why we are still together- if there are problems we fix them. Neither of us would throw a huffy fit, stick our fingers in our ears and run off, demanding that we still share the same bank account (£), retain membership in the same club (EU) or keep the same monarchy. If there was to be a break it would be for rational reasons, despite there being undoubted emotional baggage attached. Whatever happens.... I would not be moving in with Rick. Edited August 31, 2014 by bluto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickMcD Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 Unsurprisingly, so much derisory insane assumption that I shouldn't be tempted to respond but 5 minutes of mild amusement and corrective text beckons. How do "those people" (I assume you mean foreign students and immigrants seeking work) contribute more to Scotland right now, given that I have worked three weeks a month since April in Scotland, spending above 2grand a week - not including food, transport and accommodation - on showing other foreign people how wonderful Scotland is? Not forgetting that I have a lifetime of being Scottish and an understanding of the land and its society, that is way beyond anything "those people " could ever have.... And most Scots, too. (Btw SNLT, the French are able to have their ex-pats Nationals vote in their elections, so it's not beyond the wit of Scotland to also achieve this. It was a political decision of Yes-men, just as giving the vote to 16yo was. I understand their gamble, but don't think it will work) Back to the madman... This personal gain.... in this current work I do, I actually earn less than I could by doing other stuff in London... Because I chose to do so. Similarly, in the early 70s, I left £70 a day work in London for £20 a week in the north of Scotland. I may have missed that a factor in voting qualification was related to pursuit of personal gain and personal wealth - so am I to assume that after Sep 18, Capitalism will be abolished in Scotland? And just to be clear, I didn't leave the country, I stayed in the UK and went to London. I don't have a wife. If my woman and I were to consider splitting, it would be as a mutual action, after shared consideration of problems in our relationship that we would maturely discuss, address and try to fix. That is why we are still together- if there are problems we fix them. Neither of us would throw a huffy fit, stick our fingers in our ears and run off, demanding that we still share the same bank account (£), retain membership in the same club (EU) or keep the same monarchy. If there was to be a break it would be for rational reasons, despite there being undoubted emotional baggage attached. Whatever happens.... I would not be moving in with Rick. FFS, Bluto (just put that in because everybody seems to be saying it) I try to avoid the forum's least favourite misanthrope but I've seen yon post because of you. I do read your intelligent posts and your other stuff as well. Agree completely about the ex-pats and 16 yr.old votes. Salmond would have jumped at it if he thought there was any chance of getting a majority of them. But he's a politician so he gets away with rigging it in his favour. Just a thought, doesn't wee Eck want half a million eastern Europeans if his pipedream comes true? Will they get the vote in time? That's rhetorical btw.(Just put that in because nearly everybody does) Anyway, the point of my post is, where are you going? As you know, bOaky has never been wrong in his puff so you must be moving. I'm sure you would be a very generous ludger, but I don't want you moving in here. Just in case you try to change your mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salmonbuddie Posted September 1, 2014 Report Share Posted September 1, 2014 This old chestnut........ Fair enough, gents, explain the criteria you would apply to determine who should be eligible to vote but currently isn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluto Posted September 1, 2014 Report Share Posted September 1, 2014 Passport, place of birth - then registering a desire to vote. That data for checking is already held by government. Simples. Few people would wish to participate in Cooncil elections, but this upcoming stupidity directly impacts on us all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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