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mattman

Jack Baird joins Morton

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1 hour ago, TPAFKATS said:
1 hour ago, magnus said:
True. But neither do some of the millionaires that turn out for Scotland and still  play pish.

No, but it's no cheeseys fault

Absolutely. I am pro Cheesey. Glad he is enjoying his football again. 🙌

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7 minutes ago, magnus said:

Absolutely. I am pro Cheesey. Glad he is enjoying his football again. 🙌

I thought Cheesy positional sense was shocking and he really struggled to read a game. He ball watched all the time....was in cup winning team so will always be grateful to him for that...

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Just now, gstretchuk said:

I thought Cheesy positional sense was shocking and he really struggled to read a game. He ball watched all the time....was in cup winning team so will always be grateful to him for that...

I thought he was terrible in his last season. Confidence gone. I was never convinced that it was Cheesey who had poor positional sense. Jason N and Sean K were known to stoat aboot. I thought Cheesey could pick a great pass when he was on his game. Overall in my good guy book and as you say a Cup Winner = legend.

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5 minutes ago, magnus said:

I thought he was terrible in his last season. Confidence gone. I was never convinced that it was Cheesey who had poor positional sense. Jason N and Sean K were known to stoat aboot. I thought Cheesey could pick a great pass when he was on his game. Overall in my good guy book and as you say a Cup Winner = legend.

Cheesy consistently watched the ball and couldn't read the game, was never confident with him in team...

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13 hours ago, Yflab said:

Interesting that Cheesy is playing in the top tier in Iceland. A country that is boasting a better record in international football that our nation despite only having a population of 330,000.

National leagues and international side correlations can be misleading. Wales and NI had decent Euro 2016 campaigns but have two of the worst leagues in Europe, although with Wales, they do have better sides playing in England. Cardiff and Swansea would be the old firm equivalent without the bigotry.

The ROI are always capable of qualifying but their league is pretty poor, it’s only in the past decade they’ve finally made headway in Europe with Dundalk and Shamrock Rovers making the Europa Groups. The thing is, ROI, Wales and NI, much like Iceland, don’t have any local players in the national side - they mainly play abroad.

Your last statement is proof that a good national side is about the youth system in place. A small population, but doing an excellent job. It’s all about how you coach youth.

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4 hours ago, Cornwall_Saint said:

National leagues and international side correlations can be misleading. Wales and NI had decent Euro 2016 campaigns but have two of the worst leagues in Europe, although with Wales, they do have better sides playing in England. Cardiff and Swansea would be the old firm equivalent without the bigotry.

The ROI are always capable of qualifying but their league is pretty poor, it’s only in the past decade they’ve finally made headway in Europe with Dundalk and Shamrock Rovers making the Europa Groups. The thing is, ROI, Wales and NI, much like Iceland, don’t have any local players in the national side - they mainly play abroad.

Your last statement is proof that a good national side is about the youth system in place. A small population, but doing an excellent job. It’s all about how you coach youth.

Couldn’t agree more, this is where Scottish football is falling down & why those in charge at the SFA & SPFL should lose their jobs with the whole structure being reviewed. 

There isn’t a great incentive/ will at many Scottish clubs to better support their youth development & there isn’t the mentality in Scotland to get youngsters playing as often as they can with all the support they need. 

Seeing it changing very gradually but it’s far from enough. We need a clear out of the dinosaurs in our game & tough new rules in place that not only encourage youth development but force it at every club in our structure (something that likely won’t happen because of the control the bigots have over our game & their ability to sign & play large numbers of foreign exports) 

for me I would reintroduce rules along the lines of homegrown talent. with a minimum number of a clubs own youth graduates having to feature in every starting 11. 

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4 hours ago, bazil85 said:

Couldn’t agree more, this is where Scottish football is falling down & why those in charge at the SFA & SPFL should lose their jobs with the whole structure being reviewed. 

There isn’t a great incentive/ will at many Scottish clubs to better support their youth development & there isn’t the mentality in Scotland to get youngsters playing as often as they can with all the support they need. 

Seeing it changing very gradually but it’s far from enough. We need a clear out of the dinosaurs in our game & tough new rules in place that not only encourage youth development but force it at every club in our structure (something that likely won’t happen because of the control the bigots have over our game & their ability to sign & play large numbers of foreign exports) 

for me I would reintroduce rules along the lines of homegrown talent. with a minimum number of a clubs own youth graduates having to feature in every starting 11. 

It needs to go deeper than that.

I’ve said it before on here and I say it again - I watched both my national teams go into decline in the early 2000s. While the SFA ignored the problems and basically said “nah, it’ll be fine”, Belgium feared the path they were heading towards. They sent Michel Sablon out across Europe to watch what others did, and how we could learn from it. Eventually we settled on the combination of total football of the Dutch, with the physicality of the French. Across the country we changed youth - small sided games, small pitches, only with age would you go into bigger teams and bigger pitches. The key to this was that every single player learns about having the ball in a small space, and it teaches them to act and think quickly. When you watch our national side, there’s an urgency, a pace to the game. That’s why our counter attack is deadly, and when in possession, we don’t fanny around like the Spanish, we always aim to move forward. The whole starting XI want the ball, they make themselves open. They’ve all learned from a young age about how to keep the ball, play quick, and gain confidence. You watch teams in Scotland and half of them seem to shite themselves when on the ball. In Belgium you won’t make the top level with that mentality.

From a Belgian perspective the national team is a joy to watch, with that combination of possession, attacking, and a counter attack that can be deadly. We probably appreciate it more too considering how bad we were ten-fifteen years ago. But our coaching was the reason behind the success. By all means, we hit some luck with guys like Eden Hazard and De Bruyne, but that entire side is quality and that was down to the efforts at grassroots with teaching them how to actually play football. Kids can learn so much from the small team - small pitch idea (which I assume we stole from the Dutch), you regularly receive the ball, learn about movement, passing, speed, all in one session. It’s very effective.

Scotland need to implement similar ideas. Belgian clubs got on board with it for the sake of the national side, and their own rewards have been seen - we now have one of the top ten leagues in Europe, and of course transfer fees for some of these guys are solid. Even my own club Charleroi, who I’d say are between 6th-10th best in the country - we have no problem spending over £1m on a transfer, something that doesn’t happen here outside of the bigots.

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15 minutes ago, Cornwall_Saint said:

It needs to go deeper than that.

I’ve said it before on here and I say it again - I watched both my national teams go into decline in the early 2000s. While the SFA ignored the problems and basically said “nah, it’ll be fine”, Belgium feared the path they were heading towards. They sent Michel Sablon out across Europe to watch what others did, and how we could learn from it. Eventually we settled on the combination of total football of the Dutch, with the physicality of the French. Across the country we changed youth - small sided games, small pitches, only with age would you go into bigger teams and bigger pitches. The key to this was that every single player learns about having the ball in a small space, and it teaches them to act and think quickly. When you watch our national side, there’s an urgency, a pace to the game. That’s why our counter attack is deadly, and when in possession, we don’t fanny around like the Spanish, we always aim to move forward. The whole starting XI want the ball, they make themselves open. They’ve all learned from a young age about how to keep the ball, play quick, and gain confidence. You watch teams in Scotland and half of them seem to shite themselves when on the ball. In Belgium you won’t make the top level with that mentality.

From a Belgian perspective the national team is a joy to watch, with that combination of possession, attacking, and a counter attack that can be deadly. We probably appreciate it more too considering how bad we were ten-fifteen years ago. But our coaching was the reason behind the success. By all means, we hit some luck with guys like Eden Hazard and De Bruyne, but that entire side is quality and that was down to the efforts at grassroots with teaching them how to actually play football. Kids can learn so much from the small team - small pitch idea (which I assume we stole from the Dutch), you regularly receive the ball, learn about movement, passing, speed, all in one session. It’s very effective.

Scotland need to implement similar ideas. Belgian clubs got on board with it for the sake of the national side, and their own rewards have been seen - we now have one of the top ten leagues in Europe, and of course transfer fees for some of these guys are solid. Even my own club Charleroi, who I’d say are between 6th-10th best in the country - we have no problem spending over £1m on a transfer, something that doesn’t happen here outside of the bigots.

Virtually every country in the world has switched onto this and when you see teams from other nations play you see how technically comfortable they are on the ball and in tight spaces. The Scottish players look like headless chickens in comparison.

I don't know how many more nations need to leapfrog us before this clicks.

We do currently IMO have good enough players at International level though - they just lack belief in each other and themselves. As I said elsewhere that comes from a fear of losing. You saw that at the weekend. We start great. Then a setback occurs and suddenly all the players go into their shell.

That's two problems to fix. Better coaching and a revamp in how we coach very young kids and also a lot more work on the mentality of the game. Less focus on winning and more on building resilience and technical skills.

We don't have the coaching setup for this at the moment as far as the evidence shows.

TBH to see the likes of Khazikstan and Costa Rica pass us off the pitch and watching us do absolutely f**k all to fix it, depresses the shit out of me.

Edited by oaksoft

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12 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

Virtually every country in the world has switched onto this and when you see teams from other nations play you see how technically comfortable they are on the ball and in tight spaces. The Scottish players look like headless chickens in comparison.

I don't know how many more nations need to leapfrog us before this clicks.

We do currently IMO have good enough players at International level though - they just lack belief in each other and themselves. As I said elsewhere that comes from a fear of losing. You saw that at the weekend. We start great. Then a setback occurs and suddenly all the players go into their shell.

That's two problems to fix. Better coaching and a revamp in how we coach very young kids and also a lot more work on the mentality of the game. Less focus on winning and more on building resilience and technical skills.

We don't have the coaching setup for this at the moment as far as the evidence shows.

TBH to see the likes of Khazikstan and Costa Rica pass us off the pitch and watching us do absolutely f**k all to fix it, depresses the shit out of me.

Makes me laugh like feck...

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2 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

1) Virtually every country in the world has switched onto this and when you see teams from other nations play you see how technically comfortable they are on the ball and in tight spaces. The Scottish players look like headless chickens in comparison.

I don't know how many more nations need to leapfrog us before this clicks.

2) We do currently IMO have good enough players at International level though - they just lack belief in each other and themselves. As I said elsewhere that comes from a fear of losing. You saw that at the weekend. We start great. Then a setback occurs and suddenly all the players go into their shell.

3) That's two problems to fix. Better coaching and a revamp in how we coach very young kids and also a lot more work on the mentality of the game. Less focus on winning and more on building resilience and technical skills.

We don't have the coaching setup for this at the moment as far as the evidence shows.

4) TBH to see the likes of Khazikstan and Costa Rica pass us off the pitch depresses the shit out of me.

1) Total proof of how effective the system is, and why Scotland really need to look at adopting it. Whether it’s the national team or the SPL, no one seems to want the ball for fear of being the guy who gives it away. It’s also a major reason our clubs outwith the bigots never make the group stages in the Europa League - “technical” teams play them off the park. Unfortunately as you say while others click on to this, the SFA are both inept and clueless. Project Brave is a pile of complete shite, topped off by ostracising Dundee United, Falkirk and ourselves, three teams who have a reputation for developing players.

2) Belief is certainly a major issue. You wouldn’t necessarily say ROI and Iceland are miles better than us, but both have a good mentality. We’ve maybe been unlucky with some of the recent group draws, Belgium and Russia here, or Germany, Poland and ROI all together, but while the team isn’t the best, belief can push us far. Go back to the Walter Smith era where we pushed both World Cup finalists the distance - of course the quality was miles apart, but we fought like warriors, pulled out two incredible results against France, and the nation was backing Scotland all the way. Right now there’s a defeatist mentality, the fans aren’t backing them in numbers (not helped by the SFA’s ridiculous pricing) and the overall view is just dire. 

3) Funnily enough I think our own David Longwell said similar in an interview while he was in the US. No one is going to remember Dundee U14s bearing Motherwell U14s 2-1. Results mean nothing at this stage. So instead of defending the lead by punting the ball every time it reaches your box, try playing it out. Anyone can punt it, but good players make use of the possession. It might cost you a game or two, but the long term picture is the personal development of the players and not who wins the U14 league. That was part of Longwell’s philosophy.

4) I never expected an easy game in Kazakhstan, but the manner of the defeat was outrageous. The defending for the goals was abhorrent as well, to the point that San Marino would have been disappointed with the way they were conceded. While I didn’t expect Scotland to threaten Russia and Belgium for the Top 2, third place was an expectation ahead of the Kazaks, Cyprus and San Marino. At this point we can’t even be confident of beating Cyprus away and Kazakhstan at home. Hopefully Clarke will have it sorted and apart from take 3rd which should be the minimum expectation, get that confidence built for the meeting with Bulgaria in the Nations League (as Finland look good for qualification).

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2 hours ago, Cornwall_Saint said:

It needs to go deeper than that.

I’ve said it before on here and I say it again - I watched both my national teams go into decline in the early 2000s. While the SFA ignored the problems and basically said “nah, it’ll be fine”, Belgium feared the path they were heading towards. They sent Michel Sablon out across Europe to watch what others did, and how we could learn from it. Eventually we settled on the combination of total football of the Dutch, with the physicality of the French. Across the country we changed youth - small sided games, small pitches, only with age would you go into bigger teams and bigger pitches. The key to this was that every single player learns about having the ball in a small space, and it teaches them to act and think quickly. When you watch our national side, there’s an urgency, a pace to the game. That’s why our counter attack is deadly, and when in possession, we don’t fanny around like the Spanish, we always aim to move forward. The whole starting XI want the ball, they make themselves open. They’ve all learned from a young age about how to keep the ball, play quick, and gain confidence. You watch teams in Scotland and half of them seem to shite themselves when on the ball. In Belgium you won’t make the top level with that mentality.

From a Belgian perspective the national team is a joy to watch, with that combination of possession, attacking, and a counter attack that can be deadly. We probably appreciate it more too considering how bad we were ten-fifteen years ago. But our coaching was the reason behind the success. By all means, we hit some luck with guys like Eden Hazard and De Bruyne, but that entire side is quality and that was down to the efforts at grassroots with teaching them how to actually play football. Kids can learn so much from the small team - small pitch idea (which I assume we stole from the Dutch), you regularly receive the ball, learn about movement, passing, speed, all in one session. It’s very effective.

Scotland need to implement similar ideas. Belgian clubs got on board with it for the sake of the national side, and their own rewards have been seen - we now have one of the top ten leagues in Europe, and of course transfer fees for some of these guys are solid. Even my own club Charleroi, who I’d say are between 6th-10th best in the country - we have no problem spending over £1m on a transfer, something that doesn’t happen here outside of the bigots.

My fear is this won’t change anytime soon. Head in the sand views around the people in charge of our game & complete lack of innovation, penny pinching & content at mediocrity. We’ll continue to tumble IMO. 

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28 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

My fear is this won’t change anytime soon. Head in the sand views around the people in charge of our game & complete lack of innovation, penny pinching & content at mediocrity. We’ll continue to tumble IMO. 

I imagine you are probably right here, especially as the recent addition of Project Brave (which I mentioned in response to oaksoft) is pish. In Scotland there still seems to be the mentality of picking the “big” players at youth level and booting out the wee skilful guys. The likes of Shaun Maloney and Lewis Morgan got the boot at youth level for these reasons. Again as I said above, results are meaningless at youth level. The focus is on winning instead of developing. Tell the kids the result means nothing, demand that they pass and move, keep the ball down. If they concede an equaliser late on because they passed out from the back, then that’s fine, because they’ll learn more from passing and moving instead of clearing the ball long for the 17th time to secure a win. 

The other problem is that no matter how shite Neil Doncaster and co are, we canny get them shifted. We need wholesale changes top to bottom, and it needs to start with the boardroom in Hampden.

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Swap De Bruyne, Lukaku, Alderweireld and Vertonghen for McGregor, Phillips, Mulgrew and Cooper and Scotland would have won!

Guys like Robertson, Tierney, McTominay, McGinn, Fraser and Snodgrass would all make that Belgium squad. Indeed, guys like Matt Ritchie and James McArthur would make the Belgium squad.

If we could find a couple of quality centre backs then I believe we could actually be competitive with this squad.

We have quality midfielders, wide players and left backs. We’ve also had good keepers for the past few years. It would be good to find a striker as well but at least a couple of central defenders would give the team a backbone to build on.

I remember watching Scotland beat Spain 3-1 at Hamden in 1985. We were so good in central defence that Alan Hansen didn’t even make the bench and Richard Gough was a sub.

Mind you, we were so good back then that even Gordon Strachan only made the bench!

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2 minutes ago, cockles1987 said:
5 minutes ago, Kemp said:
Has a St Mirren player ever been sent to Morton on loan before (or vice versa?)
Morton fans are usually going to be on his back after a couple of mistakes.

Yes

Illuminating insight, Cockles.

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2 hours ago, Wendy Saintss said:

Swap De Bruyne, Lukaku, Alderweireld and Vertonghen for McGregor, Phillips, Mulgrew and Cooper and Scotland would have won!

Guys like Robertson, Tierney, McTominay, McGinn, Fraser and Snodgrass would all make that Belgium squad. Indeed, guys like Matt Ritchie and James McArthur would make the Belgium squad.

If we could find a couple of quality centre backs then I believe we could actually be competitive with this squad.

We have quality midfielders, wide players and left backs. We’ve also had good keepers for the past few years. It would be good to find a striker as well but at least a couple of central defenders would give the team a backbone to build on.

I remember watching Scotland beat Spain 3-1 at Hamden in 1985. We were so good in central defence that Alan Hansen didn’t even make the bench and Richard Gough was a sub.

Mind you, we were so good back then that even Gordon Strachan only made the bench!
 

Totally agree. 2 center backs, a right back and a top quality striker and we would be a decent side. We are not a million miles away contrary to what is being said.

Young guys like Billy Gilmour coming through at Chelsea and Karomoko Dembele at Celtic are not a million miles away.

We've have been up against England, Belgium etc over last few years . Lets see what happens when we get a group with the likes of Romania, Hungary etc.

Still think we will have a great chance in play off as the teams will in the main be beatable.

Edited by lenziebud

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