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Lord Pityme

Kibble/SMiSA Partnership Proposal (Merged)

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If you are a current, former or potential smisa member you need to understand this!

Smisa is a Community Benefit Society, the crucial reasons for Smisa taking the lead in Fans owning the club are possibly much more crucial and fundamental than you may consider?

 

Yes if the fans ( Smisa & small shareholders) own over 90% of the club, then no one organisation or individual can come in and run the club to suit the aims, which may not be in the club's best interests.

 

But there are much more deeper, fundamental reasons that the club chairman, Smisa committee and shockingly an outside organisation are being allowed to "condition" you into believing "it's a done deal so just agree" and not consider before deciding how to vote.

 

A community benefit society can only sell its assets if the proceeds of that sale benefit the community. The club chairman, Kibble and smisa committee know this, and know this sale of over a quarter of the club to Kibble could not happen when Smisa takes over!

 

So their joint aim is to deceive/convince you this is "the greatest deal ever" as they need you to do it now, before it becomes illegal.

 

In essence they are trying to play you to agree whilst They benefit from it.

There is not one reason why the club could not start to deliver almost every service that Kibble offer!

The hard fact is Kibble want YOUR community asset to be able to use it to provide services to people from all over the UK. That's their business, why should we hand over our communities asset to benefit Kibble?

Indeed the club actually make money at present from hiring facilities to Kibble that go directly into benefitting the community!

There is no reason why, if required we couldnt hire/partner Kibble, or any other providers of the type of service we cant deliver ourselves, until we were able to deliver it ourselves without selling our community asset!

But that crucially doesn't bebefit Kibble as much as it does OUR community!

They are desperate for you to let this shocking stripping of your community asset NOW... before it becomes Illegal.

So the simple question I believe Smisa members should consider is... " do I want to benefit my community with our assets, or Kibble and our chairman's bank balance?

There are so many things others have said the club could never do, or be, that we have done and become. Play the long game, hold onto your community asset and use it to benefit your club and community.

This below is what we should be building ourselves, not subbing it out in bits and pieces...

https://www.foundationoflight.co.uk/about-us/

 

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Is this the same asset stripping that Skyview were surely going to do, or different? 
Absoulte tinfoil hat stuff, this. 
Ffs dont you think the fans/community losing over a quarter of THEIR asset is an issue you can engage with, or are you just with the school kid stuff?

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31 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

 

If you are a current, former or potential smisa member you need to understand this!

Smisa is a Community Benefit Society, the crucial reasons for Smisa taking the lead in Fans owning the club are possibly much more crucial and fundamental than you may consider?

But St Mirren FC is not a CBS.

 

Yes if the fans ( Smisa & small shareholders) own over 90% of the club, then no one organisation or individual can come in and run the club to suit the aims, which may not be in the club's best interests.

 

But there are much more deeper, fundamental reasons that the club chairman, Smisa committee and shockingly an outside organisation are being allowed to "condition" you into believing "it's a done deal so just agree" and not consider before deciding how to vote."

I am not being conditioned into believing it is a done deal and have already pointed out on another thread that the deal is dependent on a vote of SMISA members.

 

A community benefit society can only sell its assets if the proceeds of that sale benefit the community. The club chairman, Kibble and smisa committee know this, and know this sale of over a quarter of the club to Kibble could not happen when Smisa takes over!

SMISA is not selling its assets. The shares that Kibble intends to buy do not belong to SMISA, but to Gordon Scott.

 

So their joint aim is to deceive/convince you this is "the greatest deal ever" as they need you to do it now, before it becomes illegal.

 

In essence they are trying to play you to agree whilst They benefit from it.

There is not one reason why the club could not start to deliver almost every service that Kibble offer!

The hard fact is Kibble want YOUR community asset to be able to use it to provide services to people from all over the UK. That's their business, why should we hand over our communities asset to benefit Kibble?

Indeed the club actually make money at present from hiring facilities to Kibble that go directly into benefitting the community!

There is no reason why, if required we couldnt hire/partner Kibble, or any other providers of the type of service we cant deliver ourselves, until we were able to deliver it ourselves without selling our community asset!

But that crucially doesn't bebefit Kibble as much as it does OUR community!

They are desperate for you to let this shocking stripping of your community asset NOW... before it becomes Illegal.

So the simple question I believe Smisa members should consider is... " do I want to benefit my community with our assets, or Kibble and our chairman's bank balance?

There are so many things others have said the club could never do, or be, that we have done and become. Play the long game, hold onto your community asset and use it to benefit your club and community.

This below is what we should be building ourselves, not subbing it out in bits and pieces...

https://www.foundationoflight.co.uk/about-us/

 

As for benefiting the Chairman's bank balance, you conveniently forget that he was the only one prepared to but up the cash to allow BTB to go ahead. Under the proposed deal he will certainly get his money earlier than he thought, but you have no idea what his present financial circumstances are and whether he might need this. You needs to get rid of the huge chip on your shoulder.

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I’m interested to see how much money we make from Kibble at present. 
 

Considering they own and run ‘the Experience’ out in Hillington that has plenty of space, I’d be surprised if they spent huge amount with us.

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1 hour ago, Lord Pityme said:

 

If you are a current, former or potential smisa member you need to understand this!

Smisa is a Community Benefit Society, the crucial reasons for Smisa taking the lead in Fans owning the club are possibly much more crucial and fundamental than you may consider?

 

Yes if the fans ( Smisa & small shareholders) own over 90% of the club, then no one organisation or individual can come in and run the club to suit the aims, which may not be in the club's best interests.

 

But there are much more deeper, fundamental reasons that the club chairman, Smisa committee and shockingly an outside organisation are being allowed to "condition" you into believing "it's a done deal so just agree" and not consider before deciding how to vote.

 

A community benefit society can only sell its assets if the proceeds of that sale benefit the community. The club chairman, Kibble and smisa committee know this, and know this sale of over a quarter of the club to Kibble could not happen when Smisa takes over!

 

So their joint aim is to deceive/convince you this is "the greatest deal ever" as they need you to do it now, before it becomes illegal.

 

In essence they are trying to play you to agree whilst They benefit from it.

There is not one reason why the club could not start to deliver almost every service that Kibble offer!

The hard fact is Kibble want YOUR community asset to be able to use it to provide services to people from all over the UK. That's their business, why should we hand over our communities asset to benefit Kibble?

Indeed the club actually make money at present from hiring facilities to Kibble that go directly into benefitting the community!

There is no reason why, if required we couldnt hire/partner Kibble, or any other providers of the type of service we cant deliver ourselves, until we were able to deliver it ourselves without selling our community asset!

But that crucially doesn't bebefit Kibble as much as it does OUR community!

They are desperate for you to let this shocking stripping of your community asset NOW... before it becomes Illegal.

So the simple question I believe Smisa members should consider is... " do I want to benefit my community with our assets, or Kibble and our chairman's bank balance?

There are so many things others have said the club could never do, or be, that we have done and become. Play the long game, hold onto your community asset and use it to benefit your club and community.

This below is what we should be building ourselves, not subbing it out in bits and pieces...

https://www.foundationoflight.co.uk/about-us/

 

So tell me, what is it Kibble are proposing to do that's about to become illegal? 

And, if I'm reading the Q+A properly, big decisions like selling off club assets requires unanimous support on the board. How do Kibble and their 2 directors get this through a board meeting when their in the minority with SMISA? 

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As for benefiting the Chairman's bank balance, you conveniently forget that he was the only one prepared to but up the cash to allow BTB to go ahead. Under the proposed deal he will certainly get his money earlier than he thought, but you have no idea what his present financial circumstances are and whether he might need this. You needs to get rid of the huge chip on your shoulder.
Wrong!
Smisa.. the fans are putting up ALL the money!
And... crucially could have BtB themselves!
But then Scott would have been stuck with those shares again!
Have any opinion you want, but ffs wake up and get real about exactly Who, needs/needed Who?

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So tell me, what is it Kibble are proposing to do that's about to become illegal? 

And, if I'm reading the Q+A properly, big decisions like selling off club assets requires unanimous support on the board. How do Kibble and their 2 directors get this through a board meeting when their in the minority with SMISA? 

Read the post! Once/If..? Smisa take ownership of Scott's shares they are an asset of the community benefit society Smisa 1877. And cant be sold, unless the proceeds of that sale benefit the community. I.e smisa members, saints fans, all the local groups that the club/trust does or should work with/for.

 

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10 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Read the post! Once/If..? Smisa take ownership of Scott's shares they are an asset of the community benefit society Smisa 1877. And cant be sold, unless the proceeds of that sale benefit the community. I.e smisa members, saints fans, all the local groups that the club/trust does or should work with/for.

 

I have read your post, and I have questions - hence the post. What is it that Kibble are proposing is about to become illegal?

Direct me to the draft legislation, please. A URL 

I think your biggest issue is not from the point where SMISA take control of the 51%, but during the transition period where there's no majority shareholder - is that correct? 

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8 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Wrong!
Smisa.. the fans are putting up ALL the money!
And... crucially could have BtB themselves!
But then Scott would have been stuck with those shares again!
Have any opinion you want, but ffs wake up and get real about exactly Who, needs/needed Who?

If BTB goes through as originally envisaged the fans will eventually have put up all the money, but you still have not told me who was prepared to kick start the bid by putting up several hundred thousand pounds. The previous board was desperate to sell up and might well have sold out to some outsider/asset stripper without the intervention of Gordon Scott.

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I have read your post, and I have questions - hence the post. What is it that Kibble are proposing is about to become illegal?
Direct me to the draft legislation, please. A URL 
I think your biggest issue is not from the point where SMISA take control of the 51%, but during the transition period where there's no majority shareholder - is that correct? 
Really?
Kibble can't buy the shares from smisa legally, unless the proceeds benefit the community.

So they have to buy them from Scott. Hence why this is being pushed as all done, and such a great deal. Kibble want the club, and are prepared to pull this stunt to get in.

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If BTB goes through as originally envisaged the fans will eventually have put up all the money, but you still have not told me who was prepared to kick start the bid by putting up several hundred thousand pounds. The previous board was desperate to sell up and might well have sold out to some outsider/asset stripper without the intervention of Gordon Scott.

They would, and wanted to sell to smisa. And were prrepared to wait a bit for smisa to raise the down payment.

There were social funding bodies prepared to lend and even grant smisa the money if it benefitted the community I.e. training/development opportunities, jobs etc...

Guess who wasnt keen on that?

 

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21 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Read the post! Once/If..? Smisa take ownership of Scott's shares they are an asset of the community benefit society Smisa 1877. And cant be sold, unless the proceeds of that sale benefit the community. I.e smisa members, saints fans, all the local groups that the club/trust does or should work with/for.

 

So, if they sell to Kibble, a charity who works with and supports young people in care, how is that not benefitting the community? 

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They would, and wanted to sell to smisa. And were prrepared to wait a bit for smisa to raise the down payment. There were social funding bodies prepared to lend and even grant smisa the money if it benefitted the community I.e. training/development opportunities, jobs etc...
Guess who wasnt keen on that?
 


I'm going to guess you.

I'm sure you used the term the only show in town once or a thousand times.

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So, if they sell to Kibble, a charity who works with and supports young people in care, how is that not benefitting the community? 
Kibble's clients come from a over Scotland and England. It's not a community specific operation like say the local food bank.

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Indeed the club actually make money at present from hiring facilities to Kibble that go directly into benefitting the community!


But, what was it you've previously wrote or claimed. SMFC only receive a pittance or was it also they get the use for free.

So how much is it they contribute financially. Can you provide a figure if there is one according to yourself?

I predict there wont be an answer to this from LPM





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Just now, cockles1987 said:

1, By giving jobs to the staff.

2, Rehabilitation of youths.

There's a couple of examples. emoji106.png

Point one, as I don't know the break down on employing local people I'll leave that to a side.

Point two, these youths, and my daughter worked there for 3 months, are mainly from other areas, how is that helping the local community?

I know you're falling over yourself to disprove EVERYTHING he says but there's many parts of his posts that are true and many that throw up interesting scenarios.

 

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Just for clarity, I think Kibble provide a valuable service of opportunity, hope and rehabilitation of young people who otherwise may not have gotten a second chance.
In rejecting this proposal none of that will change, indeed working in partnership by the fan owned Smfc and community trust we can build it bigger and brighter as partners!

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Point one, as I don't know the break down on employing local people I'll leave that to a side.
Point two, these youths, and my daughter worked there for 3 months, are mainly from other areas, how is that helping the local community?
I know you're falling over yourself to disprove EVERYTHING he says but there's many parts of his posts that are true and many that throw up interesting scenarios.
 


I know neither of the exact breakdowns. But do know as you also concede there is.

I take it you're not referring to Hendo's post regarding disproving. I'm quite happy showing up anyone guilty of hypocrisy, lying, bigotry etc

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9 minutes ago, FTOF said:

There's certainly one person on this thread teetering on the brink.

 

He remind me of the guy from Wales who was seen everyday by the BBC cameras outside parliament dress up in the European colours protesting against Brexit   :lol:

 

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