4 told they can leave

[proudtobeabuddy]

1 minute ago, billyg said:

I'm saying they got lucky with the appointment of JR and have made a roaring c**t of it this time ! 3 years FFS !

I was surprised at the length too (no pun intended) but i'm assuming at least one of the parties wanted assurances of being backed and a showing of commitment. Time will tell Billy with AS i'm not guaranteeing  he'll be great but i don't want to not give the guy a chance to get it right.

[proudtobeabuddy]

6 minutes ago, Mr Optimistic said:

You are entitled to your opinion, and I admire your optimism, I just don't share it. I note you do not argue with any of the points I make about our new manager. As for Tony and Gordon, I am sure they are seeing a lot more than we are. Lets hope they can help turn this round.

I'm not arguing your points because at the moment we don't know who's right.... i sure as hell hope you're wrong as i presume you do to. Who is to say all these decisions  about players have been solely down to AS?  We've not had a good start, we've not made big signings and we're not playing well, granted, but that could all change in the coming weeks with more signings.  As the stamina of the players  improves and the team gels into the way our-management team want the team to play, we could see an improvement.  Time will tell...

[Lord Pityme]

Sorry to keep banging on about it but there does seem to be a lot of Fake News on here. So far the only playets Stubbzo has let go are Stewart & Hippolyte, one got no league starts last season, the other i think one and a few subs.

so to say he is ripping the squad apart is way wide of the mark. Ross let over a dozen go, or wind down their contracts, where was his loyalty to leave a legacy in getting those winding down re-signed? His two new signings havent set the heather alight!

if you believe that Ross inherited a mess from Rae, then logic would suggest Stubbzo has inherited a bigger mess as we barely have a squad. Yeah thanks Jack!

Edited July 26, 2018 by Lord Pityme

[billyg]

14 minutes ago, aldo_j said:

So a successful managerial appointment is lucky and a bad one is a rip roaring c**t of it?

 

In this case yes ! JR had had a good start to the season at Alloa , we needed a cheap option to work out for us and it did. Stubbs won the Scottish cup for Hibs , it was a one off , he was poor/disappointing in general terms with Hibs and Rotherham. There were other less risky options than Stubbs and I can't understand what they saw in him to give him three years. They've allowed Stubbs to rip up all the good work done by JR and throw it in the bin !

[aldo_j]

1 minute ago, billyg said:

In this case yes ! JR had had a good start to the season at Alloa , we needed a cheap option to work out for us and it did. Stubbs won the Scottish cup for Hibs , it was a one off , he was poor/disappointing in general terms with Hibs and Rotherham. There were other less risky options than Stubbs and I can't understand what they saw in him to give him three years. They've allowed Stubbs to rip up all the good work done by JR and throw it in the bin !

Said at the time that Stubbs wouldn’t be my choice, always felt he should have had Hibs promoted. Won’t have me disagreeing with that.

I’m just willing to give him a little more time. We are still in July...

[billyg]

1 minute ago, aldo_j said:

Said at the time that Stubbs wouldn’t be my choice, always felt he should have had Hibs promoted. Won’t have me disagreeing with that.

I’m just willing to give him a little more time. We are still in July...

He'll get more time , there's no other option right now unless he gets enough bad press to make him walk. Word will be getting about that things are not all well here , making it less likely for clubs to allow their players to come here on loan. I really hope we can get the whole business sorted out before flag day next week , but I just don't see it !

[Lord Pityme]

1 minute ago, aldo_j said:

Said at the time that Stubbs wouldn’t be my choice, always felt he should have had Hibs promoted. Won’t have me disagreeing with that.

I’m just willing to give him a little more time. We are still in July...

This.

and... we are paying the price for the many mediocre and gash recruitment choices Ross made. Lets not forget in 18 months he made nearly 40 signings, and for reasons best known to himself thought that either Mullen or Hippolyte would be an adequate replacement for Morgan ffs.... neither of whom were regular starts at their last team at the point of signing..!

add to that we lost thirty odd goals in Morgan & Reilly, Davis walked, and Smith went back to Hearts. Ross has Wrecked us and fecked off for the money. stubbzo is frantically trying to make a silk purse out of a pig's ear..!

[nedflanders123]

56 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

This.

and... we are paying the price for the many mediocre and gash recruitment choices Ross made. Lets not forget in 18 months he made nearly 40 signings, and for reasons best known to himself thought that either Mullen or Hippolyte would be an adequate replacement for Morgan ffs.... neither of whom were regular starts at their last team at the point of signing..!

add to that we lost thirty odd goals in Morgan & Reilly, Davis walked, and Smith went back to Hearts. Ross has Wrecked us and fecked off for the money. stubbzo is frantically trying to make a silk purse out of a pig's ear..!

FWIW the feel good factor got a boot in the baws when JR decided to up sticks and leave along with the 4 key players you mentioned.  That left the club with a chasm to fill and managerial choices were limited. JR was always going to be a hard act to follow based on his success but we will never know if he would have cut it at this level - he will have more cash at a bigger club now.

Stubbs is experienced and well regarded and has a tough job. I think he needs to be given far more time to get the type of players he thinks are required and to develop a system that will have them playing the way he wants them to.  There are no guarantees in the game and some players will succeed while others don't work out (as indicated by the number JR brought in and moved on).  We have no idea what is going on behind the scene re AS trying to get players in.  It appears that a number of his targets have not materialised (prob due to agents securing better deals) and it's not as easy as some think to get the quality you feel is necessary - we operate at a certain level.  We also need to give the new guys time to adjust and get fit.  People were raving about Coulson v Killie and how well the team performed.  That shows there is talent there.  Judging the manager and players before the paint on AS's door has dried is a bit premature imho.  I will wait to see how the squad shape up over the next month or so before judging anyone.

 

Edited July 26, 2018 by nedflanders123

[DougJamie]

43 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Sorry to keep banging on about it but there does seem to be a lot of Fake News on here. So far the only playets Stubbzo has let go are Stewart & Hippolyte, one got no league starts last season, the other i think one and a few subs.

so to say he is ripping the squad apart is way wide of the mark. Ross let over a dozen go, or wind down their contracts, where was his loyalty to leave a legacy in getting those winding down re-signed? His two new signings havent set the heather alight!

if you believe that Ross inherited a mess from Rae, then logic would suggest Stubbzo has inherited a bigger mess as we barely have a squad. Yeah thanks Jack!

Can i just say LPM since Stu D got canned ur posts have been positive realistic and supportive. Have u been exorcised ?

[Drew]

1 hour ago, Mr Optimistic said:

You are entitled to your opinion, and I admire your optimism, I just don't share it.

Might be time to consider a new forum name

[Dibbles old paperboy]

37 minutes ago, nedflanders123 said:

FWIW the feel good factor got a boot in the baws when JR decided to up sticks and leave along with the 4 key players you mentioned.  That left the club with a chasm to fill and managerial choices were limited. JR was always going to be a hard act to follow based on his success but we will never know if he would have cut it at this level - he will have more cash at a bigger clubs now.

Stubbs is experienced and we'll regarded and has a tough job. I think he needs to be given far more time to get the type of players he thinks are required and to develop a system that will have them playing the way he wants them to.  There are no guarantees in the game and some players will succeed while others don't work out (as indicated by the number JR brought in and moved on).  We have no idea what is going on behind the scene re AS trying to get players in.  It appears that a number of his targets have not materialised (prob due to agents securing better deals) and it's not as easy as some think to get the quality you feel is necessary - we operate at a certain level.  We also need to give the new guys time to adjust and get fit.  People were raving about Coulson v Killie and how well the team performed.  That shows there is talent there.  Judging the manager and players before the paint on AS's door has dried is a bit premature imho.  I will wait to see how the squad shape up over the next month or so before judging anyone.

 

Stubbs is experienced? Gary Naysmith has more experience as a manager than Alan Stubbs. Stubbs has 2 years at Hibs where he had a good budget and made plenty of good signings and often had the team playing well - they also went on bad runs which cost them their ultimate prize - their main target of promotion, they didn't even reach the play off final either year when Stubbs was manager and have a look at the squad he had at his disposal (Jason Cummings, John McGinn, Dylan McGeoch, Darren McGregor, Scott Allan).  

Under Stubbs' tenure, Rotherham lost ten of their first fourteen games, winning just once. They also conceded 37 goals during this period, leaving them with the worst goal difference in the entire Football League.

Hamilton Accies seem to have had no bother getting the majority of their signings done before pre-season started and after staying up on goal difference last year they will have undertaken a similar sized overhaul of their squad as Jack Ross had envisaged at St Mirren.

[DougJamie]

5 minutes ago, Dibbles old paperboy said:

Stubbs is experienced? Gary Naysmith has more experience as a manager than Alan Stubbs. Stubbs has 2 years at Hibs where he had a good budget and made plenty of good signings and often had the team playing well - they also went on bad runs which cost them their ultimate prize - their main target of promotion, they didn't even reach the play off final either year when Stubbs was manager and have a look at the squad he had at his disposal (Jason Cummings, John McGinn, Dylan McGeoch, Darren McGregor, Scott Allan).  

Under Stubbs' tenure, Rotherham lost ten of their first fourteen games, winning just once. They also conceded 37 goals during this period, leaving them with the worst goal difference in the entire Football League.

Hamilton Accies seem to have had no bother getting the majority of their signings done before pre-season started and after staying up on goal difference last year they will have undertaken a similar sized overhaul of their squad as Jack Ross had envisaged at St Mirren.

 As you obviously feel this is a clusterfeck of an appointment- Why don't you boycott the games ( and this forum preferably) until Stubbs gets sacked . Or as we have the guy for at least 18 months start looking to his positives, as in - Hibs first ever cup success in 114 years, winning far more games than he lost. As for Rotherham- Eh- What about McInnes at Bristol- Hardly impacted his ability did it................. you have to lose to learn, if you don't learn you lose- so lets see eh

[pod]

15 minutes ago, DougJamie said:

 you have to lose to learn, if you don't learn you lose- so lets see eh

Lets hope he doesn't take to long to learn.

[DougJamie]

3 minutes ago, pod said:

Lets hope he doesn't take to long to learn.

Think he is already learning a lot. The expectation on  promoted champions is huge, the  League C group we are in, the drubbing off Sunderland, the frustrations of deals falling through, and the fact that the squad we have is no where near strong enough to compete.

I don't think we can rely on hope. We need to forget JR, as we had to forget SAF. The Club, is in great hands, we are in Top  League , we have a good solid fan base, and a solid infrastructure.

It doesn't all fall apart in friendlies, a few duff signings and a LC Campaign that has already seen Dundee and Well lose and Ross County get thumped by Arbroath....

Guy comes across as ambitious and a bit frustrated to be honest. The Learning curve, as it would have been for JR will be huge

[pod]

2 minutes ago, DougJamie said:

Think he is already learning a lot. The expectation on  promoted champions is huge, the  League C group we are in, the drubbing off Sunderland, the frustrations of deals falling through, and the fact that the squad we have is no where near strong enough to compete.

I don't think we can rely on hope. We need to forget JR, as we had to forget SAF. The Club, is in great hands, we are in Top  League , we have a good solid fan base, and a solid infrastructure.

It doesn't all fall apart in friendlies, a few duff signings and a LC Campaign that has already seen Dundee and Well lose and Ross County get thumped by Arbroath....

Guy comes across as ambitious and a bit frustrated to be honest. The Learning curve, as it would have been for JR will be huge

Lets hope he has a good working relationship with our established players.  One or two haven't been at their best or looking happy to date.

[buddies1877]

I'm saying they got lucky with the appointment of JR and have made a roaring c**t of it this time ! 3 years FFS !

FFS!

Can someone please come and collect their dad and take him away from the computer

[JJ McG]

4 minutes ago, pod said:

Lets hope he has a good working relationship with our established players.  One or two haven't been at their best or looking happy to date.

More than 1 or 2.

[nedflanders123]

46 minutes ago, Dibbles old paperboy said:

Stubbs is experienced? Gary Naysmith has more experience as a manager than Alan Stubbs. Stubbs has 2 years at Hibs where he had a good budget and made plenty of good signings and often had the team playing well - they also went on bad runs which cost them their ultimate prize - their main target of promotion, they didn't even reach the play off final either year when Stubbs was manager and have a look at the squad he had at his disposal (Jason Cummings, John McGinn, Dylan McGeoch, Darren McGregor, Scott Allan).  

Under Stubbs' tenure, Rotherham lost ten of their first fourteen games, winning just once. They also conceded 37 goals during this period, leaving them with the worst goal difference in the entire Football League.

Hamilton Accies seem to have had no bother getting the majority of their signings done before pre-season started and after staying up on goal difference last year they will have undertaken a similar sized overhaul of their squad as Jack Ross had envisaged at St Mirren.

As a player and coach. Jack was fairly inexperienced as a manager when he came to us. Why keep bringing up Rotherham? Did Hibs fans bring up Bolton when Lennon was appointed? Did Aberdeen fans bring up Bristol City when McInnes was appointed. Everyone deserves another chance and AS will be judged by what he achieves during his time as manager of St Mirren FC. As for Hamilton, let's just wait and see how they do. They have also had some crap results in the LC. BTW, Ross County - tipped by many to win the league had a night to forget against lower opposition last night. Early days and it's still July.

[billyg]

FFS!

Can someone please come and collect their dad and take him away from the computer

It’s ok , I can take care of myself thanks , ya walloper [emoji16]

[Julian Banjos]

Some amount a nonsense being talked on here from the usual suspects. Given the candidates, Stubbs was the best possible appointment for St Mirren.

Look at his CV:

Captain of Bolton at 22, England B international, Celtic's record signing, numerous trophies, Champions League experience, played 5 seasons in the English Premiership. Worked for and learned from Bruce Rioch, Tommy Burns, Wim Jansen, Martin O'Neill, Walter Smith, David Moyes and Mick McCarthy, to name a few. He started on the road to management because he was handpicked, at the age of 36, by David Moyes to coach their young players.  Don't forget either that Stubbs was diagnosed with cancer twice; the second time he thought it was gone then they found a tumour at the bottom of his spine during a routine scan. Chemotherapy and an operation followed. His kids were 2 and 4 at the time. He came back from that to play nearly 200 games for Everton. This is a strong and determined character. As for getting the sack from Rotherham, Derek McInnes and Steve Clarke suffered similar fates and are doing okay now...

Who really thinks, if they were a member of our board, that a teacher from Northern Ireland, Jim McIntyre or Gary Caldwell would be better options?

What Stubbs has done so far with us..... obviously his first problem is that he's not Jack Ross and there's nothing he can do about that. The "marquee signings" chat was a mistake. No doubt. I think he was on a wee bit of a high being back in football and after a decent performance against Killie. What's happened with G. Mac and Eck, it doesn't look great from the outside but nobody knows what's happened there (though waiting for billyg to make something up again) Regarding Eck, Stubbs signed him for Hibs so he knew what he was getting with that player. Given Eckersley's age and injury history I think it's safe to say Coulson is a better option. As for signings, they will come.

Call me mad, and I know that a whole 13 days have now passed since his first game in charge, but I remain optimistic we'll be a success under Stubbsy.  

 

 

[faraway saint]

3 hours ago, billyg said:

I'm saying they got lucky with the appointment of JR and have made a roaring c**t of it this time ! 3 years FFS !

Didn't you also say we got lucky when we won the league cup?

Looks like  any success is down to luck.

[Wendy Saintss]

3 hours ago, billyg said:

They've allowed Stubbs to rip up all the good work done by JR and throw it in the bin !

By letting go Stewart & Hippolyte, who started 1 league game between them?

[Callum Gilhooley]

4 hours ago, proudtobeabuddy said:

Not sure what they can do about individual social media accounts but rest assured there will been contact from the media officer or even GS or TF to pull them up for these comments.

There is a great deal they can do.  My own company has a very strict policy of what can and cannot be posted on social media . Posts which are seen as damaging to the company or individuals within the company are dealt with by disciplinary procedures up to and including instant dismissal for ones seen as gross misconduct.

I would like to think the company / club  lawyers have managed to include similar into players and staff contracts.

Never good to have internal squabbles played out on a public forum. 

Edited July 26, 2018 by Callum Gilhooley

[Ethan]

1 hour ago, JJ McG said:

More than 1 or 2.

Well lets hope he moves them on and gets replacements. Stubbs needs his own team and there is no place for players who are not buying into the new manager. 

[proudtobeabuddy]

40 minutes ago, Callum Gilhooley said:

There is a great deal they can do.  My own company has a very strict policy of what can and cannot be posted on social media . Posts which are seen as damaging to the company or individuals within the company are dealt with by disciplinary procedures up to and including instant dismissal for ones seen as gross misconduct.

I would like to think the company / club  lawyers have managed to include similar into players and staff contracts.

Never good to have internal squabbles played out on a public forum. 

I totally agree i'm surprise Eckersley was so silly, he's not a daft teenager.