St Mirren v Morton 31st December 2016

[BuddieinEK]

Losing Quinn AND Magennis as a result of thuggish behaviour killed us.

I reckon the subs were enforced and not through choice.

We then lost all midfield ascendency.

McLear did his best but Mallan is not a midfield general and could not stop us defending deeper and deeper.

Gutted to lose the goal and drop 2 points, but I saw a lot of positives today and some lovely football at times.

We were seconds from a win and a happy forum... But hey... It's easier to vent and criticise anyone trying to stay positive in order to encourage the team!

KTF COYS

[davidg]

10 minutes ago, BIG BEN said:

Should have went 2 up top. As is was Sutton fell deep, Morgan came inside to much allowing therefore no out ball Morton to squeeze the game. No urgency either. Big test of character now

Absolutely. As soon as Morton went to 3 at the back we should have went to 2 up top.

We had the chance to really stretch them and use the extra man. 

[John Gotti]

Ross could have brought on Baird for Quinn and had him sit in front of the back 4 and then used Hardie to run at their back 3 and try and stretch them.

[joezo21]

jack Ross asks Rocco every week how many minutes he still has in him ,  Just before the kick in the face he said  5 minutes I suppose half a loaf is better than nothing .

 

[Drew]

1 minute ago, BuddieinEK said:

Losing Quinn AND Magennis as a result of thuggish behaviour killed us.

I reckon the subs were enforced and not through choice.

We then lost all midfield ascendency.

McLear did his best but Mallan is not a midfield general and could not stop us defending deeper and deeper.

Gutted to lose the goal and drop 2 points, but I saw a lot of positives today and some lovely football at times.

We were seconds from a win and a happy forum... But hey... It's easier to vent and criticise anyone trying to stay positive in order to encourage the team!

KTF COYS

Agreed.

It was a decent game in very tough conditions. Top Cat is a bit annoyed that he can't blame Shankland for anything today, so Ross is getting both barrels.

I was sitting just to the side of the dug out, and he and Fowler were trying to urge the players forward (specifically Mallan). Duffy took a punt to get a point and it worked for him. We had been sitting off Morton before the red card, so there was always the danger that they would throw caution to the wind when down to 10.

We didn't respond well enough to that, but I wouldn't entirely blame the manager for that. I think he was as frustrated as the rest if us, but has an imbalanced squad at his disposal, and it showed in terms of the options available to him.

Had he went two up top after the sending off, and they'd hit us on the break, he would have been slated for being gung-ho when in a winning position.

You have to laugh at Top Cat having a go at the perceived naivety of Ross when playing against 10, yet he championed an alternative appointment of a manager who spectacularly failed to deliver in a cup final against 9!

[Stu]

We stopped playing just after they went down to 10, and we hadn't exactly been pushing on before that either. Was like Gus was back.

We are going down and, being pragmatic, I'd rather we started preparing now rather than wasting money on signings in the hope they'll produce the miracle we need to escape.

[southsidebud]

Gutted. Game turned on Quinn injury. Equaliser was on the cards from that point as we dropped deeper and deeper. Clarkson should be nowhere near the first XI. What was Ross thinking? He has been off the pace all season.

[BuddieinEK]

Should have could have schmood have.

Does anyone not think Jack Ross will be analysing the footage and using it to inform players.

Morgan SHOULD have taken the ball into the corner but elected to make a pass to Clarkson which cost us posession, a corner, a goal and 2 points!

Pointing that out neither achieves anything nor makes me feel any better about dropping the points so late in the game.

We win lose or draw as a team so have your vent then get back behind the boys who are fallible but doing their best.

[TopCat]

Agreed.
It was a decent game in very tough conditions. Top Cat is a bit annoyed that he can't blame Shankland for anything today, so Ross is getting both barrels.
I was sitting just to the side of the dug out, and he and Fowler were trying to urge the players forward (specifically Mallan). Duffy took a punt to get a point and it worked for him. We had been sitting off Morton before the red card, so there was always the danger that they would throw caution to the wind when down to 10.
We didn't respond well enough to that, but I wouldn't entirely blame the manager for that. I think he was as frustrated as the rest if us, but has an imbalanced squad at his disposal, and it showed in terms of the options available to him.
Had he went two up top after the sending off, and they'd hit us on the break, he would have been slated for being gung-ho when in a winning position.
You have to laugh at Top Cat having a go at the perceived naivety of Ross when playing against 10, yet he championed an alternative appointment of a manager who spectacularly failed to deliver in a cup final against 9!

You really spend a lot of time thinking about me don't you

I'm glad my views effect you so much. Have a nice new year bud.

[Drew]

Just now, TopCat said:

 

 

You really spend a lot of time thinking about me don't you

I'm glad my views effect you so much. Have a nice new year bud.

 

 

You too, hon!

[faraway saint]

31 minutes ago, Isle Of Bute Saint said:

Used to think you were quite a sensible poster. However you fail to see the bigger picture mate and im not talking about our manager before you jump the gun. 

What is this bigger picture?

Us rising like a Phoenixx from the depths of the shit division to lift the league cup again?

We're sinking faster than the fecking Titanic and I fail to see what the positives are in our current situation?

Looking like all the early season hope, takeover and all that, has been a massive failure as the main decision to sack a manager and name a new manger, has fallen on it's arse.

Who's to blame?

FFS!

[FTOF]

15 minutes ago, BuddieinEK said:

Losing Quinn AND Magennis as a result of thuggish behaviour killed us.

I reckon the subs were enforced and not through choice.
MaGennis and Quinn off
We then lost all midfield ascendency.

McLear did his best but Mallan is not a midfield general and could not stop us defending deeper and deeper.

Gutted to lose the goal and drop 2 points, but I saw a lot of positives today and some lovely football at times.

We were seconds from a win and a happy forum... But hey... It's easier to vent and criticise anyone trying to stay positive in order to encourage the team!

KTF COYS

I think it showed just how poor a squad we really have and it really is paper thin.

With Quinn and MaGennis off due to injury, there wasn't one viable option on the bench to enable a like for like replacement. Even if we had Hutton, then he'd have been as much use as a chocolate fireguard.

We're in deep shit, and unless Ross can make a few "Hail Mary" type signings, in order to compensate for the previous manager's incompetence, then I'm afraid our time is up.

[faraway saint]

2 minutes ago, Drew said:

You too, hon!

Tart!

[Dibbles old paperboy]

5 minutes ago, BuddieinEK said:

Losing Quinn AND Magennis as a result of thuggish behaviour killed us.

I reckon the subs were enforced and not through choice.

We then lost all midfield ascendency.

McLear did his best but Mallan is not a midfield general and could not stop us defending deeper and deeper.

Gutted to lose the goal and drop 2 points, but I saw a lot of positives today and some lovely football at times.

We were seconds from a win and a happy forum... But hey... It's easier to vent and criticise anyone trying to stay positive in order to encourage the team!

KTF COYS

 Everyone knows Quinn can't last 70 minutes never mind 90, so we should have a better plan in place to deal with losing him after 60 minutes rather than give up competing in midfield.  Has Clarkson ever worked as a midfield option? He is the solution to Quinn being subbed option almost every week. I'm not saying replacing Quinn with Walsh would have given us any more balance but at least when Walsh was brought on as a sub he usually looked useful and sometimes scored... unlike Clarkson. Baird probably isn't a long term solution in midfield either but today as a temporary solution when we lose two central midfielders he might have provided some dig and put some tackles in before Morton walked up to our box.

4 minutes ago, BuddieinEK said:

Should have could have schmood have.

Does anyone not think Jack Ross will be analysing the footage and using it to inform players.

Morgan SHOULD have taken the ball into the corner but elected to make a pass to Clarkson which cost us posession, a corner, a goal and 2 points!

Pointing that out neither achieves anything nor makes me feel any better about dropping the points so late in the game.

We win lose or draw as a team so have your vent then get back behind the boys who are fallible but doing their best.

Accepting Morgan should have done better, but he might argue his pass reached his team mate... why blame him when Morton still had to win the ball in their own half and when we had every chance to clear the corner after it was finally conceded.

[Julian Banjos]

To me our season is going to hinge on the 8 games against Ayr, QotS, Dumbarton and Dunfermline. There isn't any room for error in these.

In the first half of the season we managed 6/24. Second half, I reckon we need 18/24, beating at least two of them home and away, to bring at least one of them into it. A tall order.

 

[TopCat]

Regarding McPherson, I think I've posted about him once since Ross was appointed. Simply cause I have nothing else to add to the points I already made. Those points were that out of the candidates available in September I thought he was the best suited to keep us up. I did then and I still think he was. But he didn't get the job and that's that, nothing more to add.

However there's several posters who seem determined to mention him on every single thread I post in.

Fair enough. To that I will say two things. Firstly, I firmly believe there's a group of our fans who have such a deep seated hatred towards Gus that they would rather the team got relegated with JR than stayed up with Gus. Looks like they're going to get their way, nose bitten off and face spited.

Second. Imagine we had employed Gus and imagine results and performances had been exactly the same as JR has delivered. Eight points from eleven games, imagine the state of this forum then. Think there would be as many positive noises? No, me neither.

Just shows it's not who you are and what you do that matters, it's who you're not.

[BuddieinEK]

Accepting Morgan should have done better, but he might argue his pass reached his team mate... why blame him when Morton still had to win the ball in their own half and when we had every chance to clear the corner after it was finally conceded.

My point exactly.
I DON'T blame him.
What is done is done.

Let Jack and the team review it and learn from it and lets all hope they learn quickly.

Nobody is criticising Magennis, McAllister or Morgan being regulars under Jack Ross... but suddenly all the experst with superior knowledge are questioning why he dared introduce McLear.

How fickle. That sub did not cost us the 2 points dropped. Ross obviously has faith in the lad.

[Drew]

2 minutes ago, TopCat said:

Regarding McPherson, I think I've posted about him once since Ross was appointed. Simply cause I have nothing else to add to the points I already made. Those points were that out of the candidates available in September I thought he was the best suited to keep us up. I did then and I still think he was. But he didn't get the job and that's that, nothing more to add.

However there's several posters who seem determined to mention him on every single thread I post in.

Fair enough. To that I will say two things. Firstly, I firmly believe there's a group of our fans who have such a deep seated hatred towards Gus that they would rather the team got relegated with JR than stayed up with Gus. Looks like they're going to get their wish, nose bitten off and face spited.

Second. Imagine we had employed Gus and imagine results and performances had been exactly the same as JR has delivered. Eight points from eleven games, imagine the state of this forum then. Think there would be as many positive noises? No, me neither.

Just shows it's not who you are and what you do that matters, it's who you're not.

Well, that post was peppered with assumption after assumption.

I have no hatred of Gus. I simply didn't think he was the right man for the job. Just my opinion, mind. You seem to be suggesting that, because folk hold a different opinion to you, they are frothing at the mouth, irrational rockets.

I specifically brought Gus up here in the context of your criticism of Ross in terms of playing against 10 men. I found it a tad ironic, but it was really just a wee throw-away reference.

[Tommy]

39 minutes ago, Drew said:

Agreed.

It was a decent game in very tough conditions. Top Cat is a bit annoyed that he can't blame Shankland for anything today, so Ross is getting both barrels.

I was sitting just to the side of the dug out, and he and Fowler were trying to urge the players forward (specifically Mallan). Duffy took a punt to get a point and it worked for him. We had been sitting off Morton before the red card, so there was always the danger that they would throw caution to the wind when down to 10.

We didn't respond well enough to that, but I wouldn't entirely blame the manager for that. I think he was as frustrated as the rest if us, but has an imbalanced squad at his disposal, and it showed in terms of the options available to him.

Had he went two up top after the sending off, and they'd hit us on the break, he would have been slated for being gung-ho when in a winning position.

You have to laugh at Top Cat having a go at the perceived naivety of Ross when playing against 10, yet he championed an alternative appointment of a manager who spectacularly failed to deliver in a cup final against 9!

Going 2 up front against 10 men is hardly going gung ho. We started the game with 1 up against 11 men and finish with 1 up against 10   In my opinion both the players and manger bottled it today and seem to me they were frighten of Morton

[Dibbles old paperboy]

2 minutes ago, BuddieinEK said:

My point exactly.
I DON'T blame him.
What is done is done.

Let Jack and the team review it and learn from it and lets all hope they learn quickly.

Nobody is criticising Magennis, McAllister or Morgan being regulars under Jack Ross... but suddenly all the experst with superior knowledge are questioning why he dared introduce McLear.

How fickle. That sub did not cost us the 2 points dropped. Ross obviously has faith in the lad.

Happy enough to see McLear get game time. I just don't think it was fair on him to be played out of position in his first game of the league season when there were other options. McLear got Teale's vote of confidence 2 seasons ago so I'm sure he can do a decent job for us now.

Some of the options available to us today could have included going 3 at the back against 10 men and pushing Irvine or Naismith or MacKenzie from defence into central midfield to make up for the combined loss of Magennis and Quinn. We could have played central midfielder Stevie Mallan out of position in central midfield by asking him to defensive duties or put Baird on to break up their play there. Instead we sat back for 30 minutes and made no changes  aimed at turning round the one way direction of travel.

17 minutes ago, Drew said:

Well, that post was peppered with assumption after assumption.

I have no hatred of Gus. I simply didn't think he was the right man for the job. Just my opinion, mind. You seem to be suggesting that, because folk hold a different opinion to you, they are frothing at the mouth, irrational rockets.

I specifically brought Gus up here in the context of your criticism of Ross in terms of playing against 10 men. I found it a tad ironic, but it was really just a wee throw-away reference.

If Jack Ross's team were able to beat teams at home who finish with 10 men we'd be 1 point behind Ayr going into the new year.

[FTOF]

17 minutes ago, Drew said:

Well, that post was peppered with assumption after assumption.

I have no hatred of Gus. I simply didn't think he was the right man for the job. Just my opinion, mind. You seem to be suggesting that, because folk hold a different opinion to you, they are frothing at the mouth, irrational rockets.

I specifically brought Gus up here in the context of your criticism of Ross in terms of playing against 10 men. I found it a tad ironic, but it was really just a wee throw-away reference.

Cheers for quoting that tear stained  post Drew.

It's given me something to laugh at , at time of little humour.

[lenziebud]

26 minutes ago, BuddieinEK said:

My point exactly.
I DON'T blame him.
What is done is done.

Let Jack and the team review it and learn from it and lets all hope they learn quickly.

Nobody is criticising Magennis, McAllister or Morgan being regulars under Jack Ross... but suddenly all the experst with superior knowledge are questioning why he dared introduce McLear.

How fickle. That sub did not cost us the 2 points dropped. Ross obviously has faith in the lad.

I agree that McLear isn't the issue. I rate McLear highly and think he has the potential to be a first team regular like the 3 you mentioned.

I cannot for the life of me understand what Jack Ross sees in Clarkson. Utterly washed up and done.

He should have went with either Hardie or Shankland up front alongside Sutton and stretched Morton.

Shankland being my preference as he has been effective when he has come on last 20-30 mins of games

Instead he made the game 10 vs 10 by bringing on Clarkson

JR needs to do well in the window or we could be struggling as the other sides above us are picking up points and battling already. Jan and Feb are massive.

Minimum second bottom. Pretty sure we would stay up from there through a play off

 

 

 

Edited December 31, 2016 by lenziebud

[insaintee]

definitely  two points thrown away, To be fair I would have taken a draw  before the game. Morton were pretty good through out the game, but at the end we just got deeper and deeper. In saying that Sutton and Clarkson both had chances to make it safe and the subs really didn't help us. Still we look as if we might have enough to stay up and as those hankering for Gus know well, for a relegation scrap, it is all about getting something from almost every game and a point is something.

Would have liked to see Morgan and McAllistere "of the leash" a bit more, 

BTW who was the Morton Sub no 14 he looked like he as the mascot and even my arse isn't that big!

[norrie82]

I think jack has turned us into a team worth watching again.  The problem is that the current squad are losers. They do not know how to win. 2 games out of 19 is a team that is going down. We're all hoping that January brings new faces and a change but we are now 9 behind Dumbarton and 7 behind Ayr. These teams are grinding out wins and draws whilst we are not. it was quite clear early on this season was purely about survival and now we have been fighting at the bottom for months and despite a good couple of wins in early December we are really no further forward. The young lads are great and deserve credit but I have a horrible feeling that we would need to find four first picks in the first week of Jan to give ourselves hope. We still look vulnerable and with a hugely important league fixture against queens next Saturday will they have the bottle. This season isn't over long time left but the mentality at the club is poor and we dont have the dogged determined approach yet that will get us out the mess.  is it going to arrive when we're almost down? Anyhow today was a sickening blow and jack will have to find a solution to the goalkeeping situation too! It's very dissapointing and sad to see the team slide I am still hopeful but realistically the team will need to replicate the second half of last season when Alex Rae took 27 points bettered only by Rangers in the second half of season. 

[Drew]

3 minutes ago, renfrew said:

Going 2 up front against 10 men is hardly going gung ho. We started the game with 1 up against 11 men and finish with 1 up against 10   In my opinion both the players and manger bottled it today and seem to me they were frighten of Morton

I didn't say it would be gung-ho. I suspect he would have been criticised had he went for it, though, rather than simply look to retain possession and hold out for the 1-0 victory.

Sadly, we didn't do either, but I don't hold Ross entirely responsible for that.